Mount Recommendations – Student Artists Prints, Drawing paper / Giclee Ink

Get help and framing advice from the framing community
Post Reply
Jim-wy
Posts: 9
Joined: Sun 02 Jul, 2017 5:20 pm
Location: Buffalo, WY
Organisation: Images of the West
Interests: Photography, Hardwood picture frames, Hiking, Woodworking.

Mount Recommendations – Student Artists Prints, Drawing paper / Giclee Ink

Post by Jim-wy »

A young artist brought me 3 prints that apparently take about 5 hours each to cook (?) and they don’t always come out the first time. The design was apparently carved in linoleum, then used to process the prints. I’m told the ink is Giclee, and the paper appears to be a thick drawing paper. She wishes all three mounted on a large mat board, then framed. She is a college student and this will be for a final presentation or show.

I’m hesitant to dry mount, not knowing if the heat would do any damage. Size is also an issue if she wishes all three on one 60” Matboard. I’m trying to help her out but don’t have many ideas. She prefers to adhere the art to the matboard without a mat on the front, would ©Framespace keep glass off the art on a 60” x 28” mount?

Attached is a picture of two of the pieces on black matboard. Any suggestions that can be passed on to the artist will be appreciated.

Sincerely, Jim

Image
Not your average framer
Posts: 11013
Joined: Sat 25 Mar, 2006 8:40 pm
Location: Devon, U.K.
Organisation: The Dartmoor Gallery
Interests: Lost causes, saving and restoring old things, learning something every day
Location: Glorious Devon

Re: Mount Recommendations – Student Artists Prints, Drawing paper / Giclee Ink

Post by Not your average framer »

If I am correct all three images appear to be on one piece of paper and unless the artist chooses to separate theses images herself they must remain as one complete print. It is not normally upto the framer not separate these combined prints into individual prints. If these prints are supplied to you all included on one piece of paper, then that is their original condition. Maintaining original condition is a real big deal, when framing anything.

I also note that the edges of the paper have decal edges and to simply cut between the images with straight line cuts would clearly be not in keeping with the other edges and to anyone looking at this prints at a later date, this would raise significant questions concerning the originality of their condition. I would simply refuse to have a part in separating these into individual images, as I would not want any blame to fall on me at a later date.

Is there any reason why all three images cannot all be framed as one complete single item? It certainly makes life much easier.

BTW, the images look great!
Mark Lacey

“Life is short. Art long. Opportunity is fleeting. Experience treacherous. Judgement difficult.”
― Geoffrey Chaucer
User avatar
prospero
Posts: 11492
Joined: Tue 05 Jun, 2007 4:16 pm
Location: Lincolnshire

Re: Mount Recommendations – Student Artists Prints, Drawing paper / Giclee Ink

Post by prospero »

Typical artist request. If she did what she suggests herself, that would be fine as the mounting would form part of the original concept.
If you did it (even with her consent) it would count as 'mutilation' and significantly devalue the work. OK, she's 'just' a student now
but who knows where her career will go? You would be creating problems for future restorers.

Never do anything to original work that you can't undo.

Instead of drymounting, a 'float' mount using hinges would make to job reversible. :D





** btw. Mark. The word is 'deckle'. You ought to know that. :lol:
Watch Out. There's A Humphrey About
Justintime
Posts: 1868
Joined: Sat 26 Sep, 2015 8:48 am
Location: West Wales
Organisation: George The Framer LLP
Interests: Gardening, design, electronic music, good food and beverages.
Contact:

Re: Mount Recommendations – Student Artists Prints, Drawing paper / Giclee Ink

Post by Justintime »

Hi Jim,
I would float mount them using archival gummed tape, Y hinges through the mountboard.
Any spacer will work, paper wrapped, hand painted barewood or framespace.
I would think 3mm glass or acrylic for this length and a brace or subframe behind.
If these are printed and have embossed edges from the process, I wouldn't use any kind of vacuum press to mount them, as this can diminish the embossing.
Even if it's student work, I'd want it to be fully reversible. If these are original press printed pieces, rather than inkjet Giclee prints, then each one is unique.
Justin George GCF(APF)
Insta: georgetheframer
User avatar
MITREMAN
Posts: 536
Joined: Thu 07 Feb, 2008 8:05 pm
Location: Norwich, Norfolk
Organisation: Framers Equipment Ltd
Interests: Conservation & box Framing memorabilia, Fishing, Sports, Keeping fit & healthy, Supporting Southend United, Computing, Cooking, Ale drinking (Camra Member), Eating out, films, Music and Concerts, DIY, Socialising, Walking, Holidays, Forest School, Wood Carving, Grandchildren and anything else I can fit in.
Location: Northampton
Contact:

Re: Mount Recommendations – Student Artists Prints, Drawing paper / Giclee Ink

Post by MITREMAN »

I agree with Justin on float mounting them, also considered the the Hedgehog method of mounting which may hold them flatter and hold that weight easier.

Post a finished image

Good luck

Jan
MITREMAN
Jan Stanlick GCF Picture Framing Consultant & Teacher
Working in association with Framers Equipment Ltd, Northampton http://www.framersequipment.co.uk
Jim-wy
Posts: 9
Joined: Sun 02 Jul, 2017 5:20 pm
Location: Buffalo, WY
Organisation: Images of the West
Interests: Photography, Hardwood picture frames, Hiking, Woodworking.

Re: Mount Recommendations – Student Artists Prints, Drawing paper / Giclee Ink

Post by Jim-wy »

This forum is great - Thank you for all the immediate input! Is there a way to reply to individual posts?

Mark, I posted that photo too hastily and should have taken time to snap all three prints. I confused my message by 'not' mentioning that there are three prints with three images on each print. I agree with you completely about not cutting the prints, fortunately that is not the case here. There are three separate prints - each with different colored paper media or print color. A more appropriate image is posted below. Thank you.

Prospero, "Typical artist request" - Ha! I agree completely, I've run into this before. I'm intrigued with the float mount idea, I'm very curious what is meant here though - what I've done with metal prints is a block of wood that makes it pop from the background. Does the term float mount hinges have a method of keeping it close to the background as if almost glued?

Justin, I think I can picture 'Y Hinges through the mountboard' but have never heard of this before - that may be the way we go! I'm going to look them up and hope I can find some good information. Is there a way to do this where the paper is not likely to curl or ripple in the future? I've primarily mounted and framed photo prints. One of the 20" x 30" prints I T-Hinged had a slight curl after about 5 years and I have only dry mounted since - not applicable for this art.

Jan - Hedgehog Method - I'm really intrigued! I will look that up. Flatness and weight holding is what I'm after! Also - we had several hedgehogs running around the house when my kids were growing up (:

Thank you all for the good feedback! Here's another snap of the prints to clarify what I'm trying to mount.

Image
User avatar
Rainbow
Posts: 891
Joined: Tue 23 Jun, 2015 8:51 am
Location: See my name, I'm somewhere over it
Organisation: Picture sales and framing
Interests: varied

Re: Mount Recommendations – Student Artists Prints, Drawing paper / Giclee Ink

Post by Rainbow »

Are all 4 edges deckle-edged? I ask because one or two of the long edges appear to be less deckled than the others, and more straight-cut. Personally I'd want all 4 edges to be equally deckled if they were mine and if not I'd cover the edges with a mount, but it's up to the artist.
Justintime
Posts: 1868
Joined: Sat 26 Sep, 2015 8:48 am
Location: West Wales
Organisation: George The Framer LLP
Interests: Gardening, design, electronic music, good food and beverages.
Contact:

Re: Mount Recommendations – Student Artists Prints, Drawing paper / Giclee Ink

Post by Justintime »

Here's a picture from the "Conservation Framing by Annabel Rushton" book.
And a link to the hedgehog technique from the Lions UK info sheets pages.
https://www.lionpic.co.uk/content/infos ... y-2019.pdf
Attachments
Y hinges annabelle rushton.jpg
Justin George GCF(APF)
Insta: georgetheframer
Jim-wy
Posts: 9
Joined: Sun 02 Jul, 2017 5:20 pm
Location: Buffalo, WY
Organisation: Images of the West
Interests: Photography, Hardwood picture frames, Hiking, Woodworking.

Re: Mount Recommendations – Student Artists Prints, Drawing paper / Giclee Ink

Post by Jim-wy »

Rainbow - Yes, all 4 are deckle-edged. I noticed that some are more so than others, but don't know if this is something that is easily modified. I believe she is content with the edges. She does not want them covered with a mat if possible, and on this forum I'm learning that there are good alternatives to top matting.

Justin - Thank you! That PDF may be my solution. I will read it again tomorrow as I did not fully understand the method, but it looks very promising!

Thanks for the great input and resources,
Jim
User avatar
prospero
Posts: 11492
Joined: Tue 05 Jun, 2007 4:16 pm
Location: Lincolnshire

Re: Mount Recommendations – Student Artists Prints, Drawing paper / Giclee Ink

Post by prospero »

The Traditional way of float-mounting is to cut slots in the mounting board and pass the hinges though to secure them
to the back. It is however quite an irksome job and the Hedgehog method does essentially the same thing. It's easier to
locate the work though. A variant is to hinge the work to a thickish board (smaller than the work) and stick this board on
top of the mounting board. This elevates to work so it really does look like it's floating. The type of paper used in this type
of printing is prone to going slightly wavy. So raising it up makes the wavy edges less apparent. Matter of taste, but sometimes
preferable on large sheets.

The trick is to make the top hinges 'hard' as the main support and add as many 'loose' hinges to the sides and bottom so as to
hold the paper down but allow a small amount of movement if the paper expands/contracts. This will depend on the environment,
but the bigger the paper the more it will move. ** A full sheet of typical paper will 'grow' half an inch when satuarated. This won't
happen normally but it will give you an idea of how dimensionally unstable paper is.

*** It's called the Hedgehog method because the chap who devised it owned the Hedgehog Gallery or something like that. :D
Watch Out. There's A Humphrey About
Justintime
Posts: 1868
Joined: Sat 26 Sep, 2015 8:48 am
Location: West Wales
Organisation: George The Framer LLP
Interests: Gardening, design, electronic music, good food and beverages.
Contact:

Re: Mount Recommendations – Student Artists Prints, Drawing paper / Giclee Ink

Post by Justintime »

There are deckle edged rulers available. I have a number of artists who use them on all work intended for floating.
https://www.lionpic.co.uk/p/10024/Deckl ... pper-500mm
Also an aluminium one somewhere.
Justin George GCF(APF)
Insta: georgetheframer
User avatar
prospero
Posts: 11492
Joined: Tue 05 Jun, 2007 4:16 pm
Location: Lincolnshire

Re: Mount Recommendations – Student Artists Prints, Drawing paper / Giclee Ink

Post by prospero »

Someone asked me about 'faux-deckling' the other day and one thing I remembered was the trick of wetting
the paper using a wet paintbrush drawn along a ruler a few times - wait for it to soak in for a minute and then
tear/pull apart gently.

The crinkley edges are a feature of a paper that is made by pouring woodpulp into a wooden frame and is generally
a sign of a hand-made product. The wooden frame is called a deckle. 8)
Watch Out. There's A Humphrey About
User avatar
MITREMAN
Posts: 536
Joined: Thu 07 Feb, 2008 8:05 pm
Location: Norwich, Norfolk
Organisation: Framers Equipment Ltd
Interests: Conservation & box Framing memorabilia, Fishing, Sports, Keeping fit & healthy, Supporting Southend United, Computing, Cooking, Ale drinking (Camra Member), Eating out, films, Music and Concerts, DIY, Socialising, Walking, Holidays, Forest School, Wood Carving, Grandchildren and anything else I can fit in.
Location: Northampton
Contact:

Re: Mount Recommendations – Student Artists Prints, Drawing paper / Giclee Ink

Post by MITREMAN »

Justine,
You should find with practice the hedgehog method very useful and easy to do.
As Prospero pointed out The trick is to make the top hinges 'hard' (Stuck to the Bevel) as the main support and add as many 'loose' hinges to the sides and bottom so as to hold the paper down but allow a small amount of movement if the paper expands/contracts."
Once you understand that the silicone paper is inserted to stop the tape sticking to the bevel as the tape bridges the bevel and silicone protection and thus only sticks to the artwork and supporting board.
Only slide out the silicone once the glue is dry.
For this method only use water-based tapes or Japanese tissues and rice starch/wheat glue and not self-adhesive as this will stick to the bevel and of course is not reversible.
The method is also very good because you can flush mount it or raise it up on a pedestal to enhance the deckle edge.

Prospero wrote
"The crinkly edges are a feature of a paper that is made by pouring wood pulp into a wooden frame and is generally
a sign of a hand-made product. The wooden frame is called a deckle"

I did not know it was called a deckle frame :clap: I once went to watch the making of hand made paper in Somerset well worth visiting a mill if you get a chance, I should have listened to more and remembered deckle frame :lol:

I use this method as Prospero wrote " Someone asked me about 'faux-deckling' the other day and one thing I remembered was the trick of wetting
the paper using a wet paintbrush drawn along a ruler a few times - wait for it to soak in for a minute and then
tear/pull apart gently.
This method I also use for making my Japanese hinges from Mulberry paper which you can find below.
http://www.framersequipment.co.uk/conservation.htm

Post A picture when completed Justin.

NOTE: if you end up doing all three pictures one board, and you wish to keep turning it over to do the next one, cover the face of the artwork with a tempory mountboard taped on with 3M Scotch Magic tape 811 this will support the artwork while handling so you can work on the next one.
http://www.framersequipment.co.uk/sealing_tapes.htm

Good Luck
Mitreman
MITREMAN
Jan Stanlick GCF Picture Framing Consultant & Teacher
Working in association with Framers Equipment Ltd, Northampton http://www.framersequipment.co.uk
Jim-wy
Posts: 9
Joined: Sun 02 Jul, 2017 5:20 pm
Location: Buffalo, WY
Organisation: Images of the West
Interests: Photography, Hardwood picture frames, Hiking, Woodworking.

Re: Mount Recommendations – Student Artists Prints, Drawing paper / Giclee Ink

Post by Jim-wy »

Followup - Thanks to all you fine people for the wonderful feedback and ideas! It took longer than I anticipated to wrap this project up but with your input it is finally complete. I ended up float mounting the art using two anchor or S-hinges and 7 Y-Hinges on each piece. I experimented with some Lineco gummed archival tape but it did not adhere very well, possibly old stock? Bad batch? User error? I purchased some mulberry paper and wheat starch and that really seemed to do a great job.

Jan / Justin - I found a Youtube Link with Roy Rowlands demonstrating the Hedgehog Technique "Float Mounting of Art on Heavier Papers" and came very close to attempting that method only I couldn't bring myself to cut 3 windows out of this large mat. I plan to try it on one of my prints in the future:

I broke two 40" x 60" pieces of glass prior to taking the third one in the box to a local framer friend to cut properly. I think I could do it now though.

The artist was not up for trying to match the deckle edges, so they were mounted as delivered, Justin - I now have one of those deckle edge rulers you pointed me to.

One taboo I permitted is to use hardboard instead of gatorboard on the back of the mat to save the artist money. I explained this to her and adhered a sheet on the back explaining care techniques along with the fact that the hardboard is not conservation material.

I regret not taking a picture of the artist next to her work because the frame is taller than she is!

Jim
IMG_0641_1200px.JPG
IMG_0634_1200px.JPG
Not your average framer
Posts: 11013
Joined: Sat 25 Mar, 2006 8:40 pm
Location: Devon, U.K.
Organisation: The Dartmoor Gallery
Interests: Lost causes, saving and restoring old things, learning something every day
Location: Glorious Devon

Re: Mount Recommendations – Student Artists Prints, Drawing paper / Giclee Ink

Post by Not your average framer »

I love both the framing and the artworks. Together, they are something really unique. I would love to know how the artist created those artworks, they are just so eye catching. I'm assuming that they are created by hand as would guess that it is a real gift to be able to do something like that at all. the artworks don't look in the least big contrived, in fact they look like something that has just grown and developed by some organic process. Simply amazing. Wow!

:clap: :clap: :clap:
Mark Lacey

“Life is short. Art long. Opportunity is fleeting. Experience treacherous. Judgement difficult.”
― Geoffrey Chaucer
User avatar
Steve N
Posts: 2992
Joined: Sat 21 Jul, 2007 2:32 pm
Location: Somewhere Staple Hill Bristol
Organisation: Frontier Picture Frames ltd
Interests: Walking our retired Greyhound,art, falling asleep on sofa in front of the telly
Location: Now in Bristol
Contact:

Re: Mount Recommendations – Student Artists Prints, Drawing paper / Giclee Ink

Post by Steve N »

nice work, but a bit stingy with the tape on the back, why not cover all the back of the moulding :sweating: :giggle:
Steve CEO GCF (020)
Believed in Time Travel since 2035

Proud to sell Ready Made Frames
http://www.frontierpictureframes.com
http://www.designerpicturemounts.com/
User avatar
MITREMAN
Posts: 536
Joined: Thu 07 Feb, 2008 8:05 pm
Location: Norwich, Norfolk
Organisation: Framers Equipment Ltd
Interests: Conservation & box Framing memorabilia, Fishing, Sports, Keeping fit & healthy, Supporting Southend United, Computing, Cooking, Ale drinking (Camra Member), Eating out, films, Music and Concerts, DIY, Socialising, Walking, Holidays, Forest School, Wood Carving, Grandchildren and anything else I can fit in.
Location: Northampton
Contact:

Re: Mount Recommendations – Student Artists Prints, Drawing paper / Giclee Ink

Post by MITREMAN »

Jim-wy

I am glad to see you managed to mount and frame your artist prints.

Just a point when using MDF backing, personally I like it when I know its going to be in safe normal environment, its strong and rigid.

I always ask the customer where its going to hang, i.e on a outside wall, damp area, over a fire, so I know what materials to advise,
if need be I would use another backing type.

But as a safe guard I always use a backing mount to hinge the artwork to and insert a sheet of mylar or archival polyester film between the backing mount and mdf to make an inert moisture barrier. You can get archival polyester film from Framers Equipment, but if you need a quick fix use tin foil.

You could also cover the back of the frame and mdf with it and tape it on with builders aluminum tape.

Painting the MDF with clear acrylic also make it water resistant.

Kind regards

Mitreman
MITREMAN
Jan Stanlick GCF Picture Framing Consultant & Teacher
Working in association with Framers Equipment Ltd, Northampton http://www.framersequipment.co.uk
Post Reply