I know there has been questions on price before BUT!!

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Holly
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I know there has been questions on price before BUT!!

Post by Holly »

Hi All,

I need your help.

I am starting out in the running my own framing business world and I am in that phase where I am riddled with self doubt over pricing and the time I take to frame things.

Could people put my mind at ease by giving me a flavour for where their working at.

My latest job has been

A0 Walnut stain wash and waxed oak box frame and fillet with 99%UV glass, print was aluminium mounted and right up to the edge of the frame so Rabbet the inner edge of the frame for protection, back board, subframe etc..

A1, with window mount total size 1000 x 750 mm frame ash, black stain wax 99% UV glass back board, subframe etc..

2 x A2, window mount ash, black stain wax , white fillet, 99% UV glass back board, subframe etc..

3 x A3 window mount ash, black stain wax , white fillet, 99% UV glass back board, subframe etc

Oh yes within that, I had to treat and compress one print which had warped massively which is included in the time and cost.

Framing time 35 hours. Total cost £977

Help, I don’t mind being told if its too much too long note enough etc etc... but I need some advice from people in the framing industry who I can trust, not gallery owners who want something for nothing. I currently feel like I am being rush rush russhed. I know I am new to this, but my quality of framing is good and I don’t think I am slow but I could be. Please give me some perspective??

Thank you for your help
Holly
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Re: I know there has been questions on price before BUT!!

Post by Holly »

Oh yes and I am based in South London
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Steve N
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Re: I know there has been questions on price before BUT!!

Post by Steve N »

Hi Holly
You have taken a week to complete 6 frames, so you should know what your overheads are, what do you need to earn per week , devide that by 40hours (or whatever you working week is in hours) then your materials plus your mark up on materials , does £977.00 cover that, it wouldn't for me, not sure what being in London has to do with it. You need to break it down per frames, costing , other members may come along and say what they would charge per sizes, also what frame / where you are getting it from would help to compare

Got to go, my evening meal is ready :Slap: :giggle:
Steve CEO GCF (020)
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Holly
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Re: I know there has been questions on price before BUT!!

Post by Holly »

Thanks Steve for your advice,

Do you mean you would charge more, or you would frame faster, just trying to gage?

Enjoy your dinner.
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Steve N
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Re: I know there has been questions on price before BUT!!

Post by Steve N »

Hi Holly
Yes I would charge more if it took me the whole week to do the 6 frames, because my overheads per week is more than £1000.00
But as I said you need to break it down per frame, as the A3 is not going to cost 25% of the A1 frame, my prices would be as follows, but I would not use a subframe on frames this size, also depends on the actual moulding

A1, with window mount total size 1000 x 750 mm frame ash, black stain wax 99% UV glass back board, £225.00

2 x A2, window mount ash, black stain wax , white fillet, 99% UV glass back board, £110.00 each = £220.00 (Taken the size is A2 glass size)

3 x A3 window mount ash, black stain wax , white fillet, 99% UV glass back board, £80.00 each = £240.00 (taken that the size is A3 glass size)

So a total of £685.00 BUT it would only take me 2-3 days at the most, but I work different, I do not just do one job at a time, I measure all the work for the week, make cut list for cutting all the mouldings, the all the glass , then If I need to do painting / staining, then I start assembling all the work, so by Wednesday afternoon I should be assembling all the work, then on Friday I should only have a few jobs to put together, normally finished by mid morning :clap: :clap:
Steve CEO GCF (020)
Believed in Time Travel since 2035

Proud to sell Ready Made Frames
http://www.frontierpictureframes.com
http://www.designerpicturemounts.com/
Holly
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Re: I know there has been questions on price before BUT!!

Post by Holly »

Thank you Steve this is really helpful.

There was in fact 7 frames the first on the list is

A0 size aluminium print.
So produced A Walnut stain wash and waxed oak box frame and fillet with 99%UV glass, print was right up to the edge of the frame so Rabbet the inner edge of the frame for protection, back board, subframe etc..

Would you be able to roughly price this for me also, if you were doing the job.

Thank you again.
Not your average framer
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Re: I know there has been questions on price before BUT!!

Post by Not your average framer »

Hi Holly,

You have picked an interesting time to start up your business, but you may have some advantages over many already exist business owners, who may not we best placed to cope with the sudden changes that come with the present difficulties. I note that you are already stain and waxing wood in preparation to making at least one of the frames that you have already mentioned.

I would suggest that this already shows a certain level of flexiblility, that may be more than helpful in these times. This may indeed be a very useful strength at this time, which may be worth making good use of in the days ahead. Don't let what may be ahead discourage you, there will be opertunities for those, who are willing to make those opertunities work for them and there's no reason why this should not means your self.

I started off my business with almost no available money and before I could get things off the ground, I had a heart attack. I already had opened a shop and needed to at least find enough money to pay the rent. Extraordinary as it may sound, the rent got paid and the business survived and I am still here to tell the tale. Logically, there was every reason not to expect the business to survive, it did. I hope you will hang on in there and expect great things.
Mark Lacey

“Life is short. Art long. Opportunity is fleeting. Experience treacherous. Judgement difficult.”
― Geoffrey Chaucer
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Steve N
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Re: I know there has been questions on price before BUT!!

Post by Steve N »

Hi Holly
I can't give you a price on that one, as I popped into the the workshop today to pick the post, so I priced up the examples in my reply, but with a frame of that size it would be at least £325. So would not be far off your price, but I, as I said would be doing more in the same time frame, to only those 7 in a week , I would need around £1500.00 , but I could not charge that, it's far too much for my customers, they would not pay that, I'm known for my reasonable prices :bow:
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Believed in Time Travel since 2035

Proud to sell Ready Made Frames
http://www.frontierpictureframes.com
http://www.designerpicturemounts.com/
Richard Photofusion
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Re: I know there has been questions on price before BUT!!

Post by Richard Photofusion »

I've sent a number of aluminium mounted baryta prints to a few client's framers. We'd bill the client around £300 for the print and mount @ A0, and on several occassions, clients told me that framing, similar to your spec cost 2-3X what the print production cost!

We're also south London, though the framers were variously West London, North London and W1. I think that for an A0, including fitting £4-600 would often be accepted by the sorts of client who would be ordering this sort of frame. And if your location is accurate, then you are in the midst of folk with proper disposable income (and you're local to them, so makes you easier to do business with in these times).

A framer local to me, with workshop, but not on street, sometimes supplies me with similar spec frames -A2 is ITRO £110 - but these are empty frames, where I do the final assembly.

If you're confident in the quality of your product, then I think you are in a position to charge considerably more - much nearer to Steve's figure.
Holly
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Re: I know there has been questions on price before BUT!!

Post by Holly »

Thank you every body for your advice and support.

What a great bunch of people there are on this forum.

Again thank you Steve for your time, it has been really helpful to get an insight into your framing world. Sounds like you are really appreciated by your customers.

Thank you Mark for your encouragement. I am fortunate in the way I have chosen to set up my business as my over heads are currently low, but the space I have for framing is well equipped. I have over the last few months been purchasing equipment bit by bit and not using the workshop thinking about how to build client numbers, and this slow approach has meant I have got some excellent deals and could save and spend, save and spend. I have enjoyed the spending part 😂 . It’s such a dream building a workshop.

I have been working as a freelancer as a framer, plus other bits, framing in house at a gallery in their tiny tiny horrible workshop and when the pandemic hit, they asked if I could work from my workshop and they would send me prints. Now I am framing, advertising and trying to make connections to see if my professional but small set up can grows some legs as my other freelance work has stopped due to the virus, my current framing amount is not quite enough. But yes Mark I look forward with hope and feel good things can always come if you are kind and supportive of others and positive and creative in mentality. Glad to hear you made a good recovery after your heart attack, and I hope your keeping yourself safe and healthy.

Richard, your from Photofusion? I know of you guys, I am fairly sure I have framed prints you have produced. I really appreciate you taking the time to reply to my thread. Your insight is really helpful as I work a lot with prints of all kind. You are right, it’s true I have managed to plant myself in the middle of a disposable income borough, this was by glorious accident and there is great irony in the amount of extreme opposites I deal with in my work to my life mentality. I am not a high street framer, people may visit the workshop by appointment. My aim is to provide quality frames, pricing in a way that doesn’t undermine my skill and experience or undermine the industry.

So fingers crossed and hard work, :giggle: my motto. :giggle:
Holly
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Re: I know there has been questions on price before BUT!!

Post by Holly »

Richard, I am sending you a private message, as its always good to know the people local to you.

Best wishes Holly
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