Black edged glass

Get help and framing advice from the framing community
Post Reply
girlfromkent
Posts: 130
Joined: Tue 29 Oct, 2019 9:02 pm
Location: Kent
Organisation: None
Interests: Printmaking & ceramics

Black edged glass

Post by girlfromkent »

Hi

I'm repairing an old frame. The customer says the previous glass had a black edge (sounds like this was from the edge of the image to the frame, the space the mount would usually fill) has anyone heard of this and know how it can be achieved?

It also had a gold line on the glass

???

Thanks
Megan
Not your average framer
Posts: 11013
Joined: Sat 25 Mar, 2006 8:40 pm
Location: Devon, U.K.
Organisation: The Dartmoor Gallery
Interests: Lost causes, saving and restoring old things, learning something every day
Location: Glorious Devon

Re: Black edged glass

Post by Not your average framer »

I think that this sounds like it might be what is known as a glass mount, when the mount has been painted on to the glass. I've read about how to create glass mounts somewhere, but I can't remember where.
Mark Lacey

“Life is short. Art long. Opportunity is fleeting. Experience treacherous. Judgement difficult.”
― Geoffrey Chaucer
girlfromkent
Posts: 130
Joined: Tue 29 Oct, 2019 9:02 pm
Location: Kent
Organisation: None
Interests: Printmaking & ceramics

Re: Black edged glass

Post by girlfromkent »

Yes that sounds like it.

Any info appreciated. Or any ideas on how to replicate a similar look. I'm thinking a slip, but inside the glass? Is that bonkers?
Not your average framer
Posts: 11013
Joined: Sat 25 Mar, 2006 8:40 pm
Location: Devon, U.K.
Organisation: The Dartmoor Gallery
Interests: Lost causes, saving and restoring old things, learning something every day
Location: Glorious Devon

Re: Black edged glass

Post by Not your average framer »

No it's not bonkers, but you won't find it all that easy first time you do it. It's pretty skillful stuff.
Mark Lacey

“Life is short. Art long. Opportunity is fleeting. Experience treacherous. Judgement difficult.”
― Geoffrey Chaucer
girlfromkent
Posts: 130
Joined: Tue 29 Oct, 2019 9:02 pm
Location: Kent
Organisation: None
Interests: Printmaking & ceramics

Re: Black edged glass

Post by girlfromkent »

I'm up for the challenge.

What would look better, black painted wooden slip with a gold sight edge added (fillet?) Inside the glass like a second frame

Black mountboard with gold wrapped foam biseaux

Spray the glass mount onto the glass (I found a short bit on it in a Pete Bingham book) but then what keeps the art from the glass?
Not your average framer
Posts: 11013
Joined: Sat 25 Mar, 2006 8:40 pm
Location: Devon, U.K.
Organisation: The Dartmoor Gallery
Interests: Lost causes, saving and restoring old things, learning something every day
Location: Glorious Devon

Re: Black edged glass

Post by Not your average framer »

I was thinking that it might be the Pete Bingham book, but I have not seen it since I moved premises, so I could not check and find out for sure. If it was me I guess I would go far the spray can, but I'm not really sure that I would want the job.
Mark Lacey

“Life is short. Art long. Opportunity is fleeting. Experience treacherous. Judgement difficult.”
― Geoffrey Chaucer
User avatar
Steve N
Posts: 2992
Joined: Sat 21 Jul, 2007 2:32 pm
Location: Somewhere Staple Hill Bristol
Organisation: Frontier Picture Frames ltd
Interests: Walking our retired Greyhound,art, falling asleep on sofa in front of the telly
Location: Now in Bristol
Contact:

Re: Black edged glass

Post by Steve N »

You paint the inside of the glass, so you work from the back.
First you get a bit of card , draw the window on it and where the gold line will be , this is to help you with masking the glass mount for painting, place your clean glass on this card, tape down on the very edges of the glass to hold it in place. Now mask off the area where the window will be with masking tape, also do the same where the gold line will be, again with masking tape, what I do o some scrap glass put a strip of masking tape on it and mark out strips the same thickness of the gold line, now with a straightedge and knife cut these sips out ane apply to your glass mount, where the gold line will be. Make sure all edges are pressed down o the glass, cane even burnish with a bone. I have used car spray paints, so spray very light coats of black spray paint allow to dry and repeat, once you are happy with the finish, VERY carefully peal off the the masking for the gold line, and spray with gold paint, or you could apply size and lay on gold leaf. If you sprayed with gold and are happy with the finish , again VERY carefully peal the masking for the window off, remove the tape holding the glass in place, well done you have made your first glass mount :handshake:
Steve CEO GCF (020)
Believed in Time Travel since 2035

Proud to sell Ready Made Frames
http://www.frontierpictureframes.com
http://www.designerpicturemounts.com/
vintage frames
Posts: 1349
Joined: Tue 12 Jun, 2012 6:05 pm
Location: West Wales
Organisation: https://www.dermotmcardle.co.uk/
Interests: Making picture frames
Contact:

Re: Black edged glass

Post by vintage frames »

The original glass mount was called a Verre Eglomise mount. That was where a gold line was drawn on the glass around the sight edge of the framed image. A bit like the beveled edge on a cardboard mount. Then the remaining area of glass to the frame edge was painted black. The line of gold needed to be laid just inside the area of black to be most effective. You would see a lot of these over Georgian prints in their original frames.
SteveN has described an easy method of replicating this.
The traditional way of making an eglomise mount was to map out the dimensions on a sheet of mountboard and tape this underneath the glass. Exactly as SteveN described.
Then using the technique of water-gilding, a wide track of gold was laid down to cover the area to be gilded. When dry, the gilding was marked out and the excess scraped away to leave a thin mirror line of gold.
After shielding the aperture area, the whole sheet of glass was then painted with black enamel paint - or a spray can.
If you want, send me the rough dimensions and I'll give you a price to make one.
Affordable Gilding Course for Professional Framers-https://www.dermotmcardle.co.uk/
https://www.instagram.com/dermotmcardle/
girlfromkent
Posts: 130
Joined: Tue 29 Oct, 2019 9:02 pm
Location: Kent
Organisation: None
Interests: Printmaking & ceramics

Re: Black edged glass

Post by girlfromkent »

Thanks both. Surely this means though that the art would be directly against the glass? Glass which has spray paint on it...? :sweating:

I am interested to know replacement cost though just for info - will message

At the mo I'm planning to attempt a similar look with black rag mat and gold mount slip. Obviously it will be different, but hopefully in keeping with what the customer remembers.
vintage frames
Posts: 1349
Joined: Tue 12 Jun, 2012 6:05 pm
Location: West Wales
Organisation: https://www.dermotmcardle.co.uk/
Interests: Making picture frames
Contact:

Re: Black edged glass

Post by vintage frames »

That's easy. Just sandwich an ordinary mount with a much wider aperture between the glass mount and the art.
You won't be able to see it behind the black of the glass mount.
Affordable Gilding Course for Professional Framers-https://www.dermotmcardle.co.uk/
https://www.instagram.com/dermotmcardle/
User avatar
Steve N
Posts: 2992
Joined: Sat 21 Jul, 2007 2:32 pm
Location: Somewhere Staple Hill Bristol
Organisation: Frontier Picture Frames ltd
Interests: Walking our retired Greyhound,art, falling asleep on sofa in front of the telly
Location: Now in Bristol
Contact:

Re: Black edged glass

Post by Steve N »

This is a pretty good book, you can use masking film, which is see through, cover the glass with it and you place on top of your design and cut out the bits you want the gold pain to be, spray the gold paint, then take off the film where you want the black, then spray that, in the end take off the window masking in the center
20200727_075311.jpg
20200727_075356.jpg
20200727_075356.jpg
20200727_075403.jpg
Or if you go the Gold leaf way, sparay the black first, then remove the masking where the gold will gold, apply the gold leaf, then remove the center where the window is
20200727_075417.jpg
20200727_075422.jpg
Saw a sign writer (on FB) use the same technique to do a sign on glass, it look great when finished
Steve CEO GCF (020)
Believed in Time Travel since 2035

Proud to sell Ready Made Frames
http://www.frontierpictureframes.com
http://www.designerpicturemounts.com/
vintage frames
Posts: 1349
Joined: Tue 12 Jun, 2012 6:05 pm
Location: West Wales
Organisation: https://www.dermotmcardle.co.uk/
Interests: Making picture frames
Contact:

Re: Black edged glass

Post by vintage frames »

Just a small technical point. If you want the gilding to have a mirror effect, then the leaf has to be water-laid. This is done first, using the mapping underneath the glass as a guide. Then the leaf is ruled into with a dampened wooden stylus and all the excess rubbed away.
Then you only need to mask out the aperture before blacking out all the rest.
Affordable Gilding Course for Professional Framers-https://www.dermotmcardle.co.uk/
https://www.instagram.com/dermotmcardle/
Not your average framer
Posts: 11013
Joined: Sat 25 Mar, 2006 8:40 pm
Location: Devon, U.K.
Organisation: The Dartmoor Gallery
Interests: Lost causes, saving and restoring old things, learning something every day
Location: Glorious Devon

Re: Black edged glass

Post by Not your average framer »

I've never been asked to do anything like that, so I've never done one, but being able to restore, or copy old things has been what my own business started on and how it grew to what I still do today. If restoring and copying older style framing is your thing, it's not been a bad thing for me and and it also could be a recipe for regular work for you to. I never advertised that I could do things like this, but gradually the word got around and more restoration and copying jobs came my way. Originally, I did not think anything of it and just assumed that other frames did it too! It was much later when I found out that I was the main guy in the area for doing this sort of thing.

Nothing about this was ever planned, it just happened. I also get customer who want old picture frames copied, so that a family photo of an earlier generation, can be copied to house a photo of the current generation. Usually the moulding used of the original frame is long gone and totally unobtainable anywhere, but I can often do something as close as possible by cutting up and combining different bits from different mouldings. It's rare to be able to make a perfect match, but I often get close enough to get a pretty reasonable match. I would not say that jobs like this come along every day, it more like every now and then. It often takes the loss of a family member to get the family wanting to get it done.

Also if you've got plenty of older houses in your area, the other useful opportunity, might be for older style hand finished frames and even stacked moulding frames, large impressive stacked moulding frames in the right style for the period of older grand houses, can be good too! I've got a few regular customers, who have a grand house somewhere else and another in Devon and sometimes you not only get to do framing for both houses, but also for multiple other family members too. For myself, I would not say that it's always been plain sailing, in fact there have been times when life has been financially quite difficult.

I would not say that this sort of business is all that you will need, because it's not and it has not been so for me either. I still need to do other things as well, including "some run of the mill" everyday framing, making cabinets and boxes, plus minor small furniture repairs and a little bit of antique funiture restoration. It is true that I already was an experienced antique furniture restorer, long before I started picture framing and had been making a living doing a bit of buying and selling, various items I was able to buy cheaply in the auctions, because they needed repairing and restoring and then selling them for more when restored.
Mark Lacey

“Life is short. Art long. Opportunity is fleeting. Experience treacherous. Judgement difficult.”
― Geoffrey Chaucer
Post Reply