Wanted 1m Version Mat cutter

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ShutterLIVING
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Wanted 1m Version Mat cutter

Post by ShutterLIVING » Wed 05 Jun, 2019 12:19 pm

Hi can anyone help? I'm looking for a...

KeenCut Ultimat Futura the small 1m version.
Happy to consider the Valiani or fletcher 2200

I'm in LONDON, no car but will hire one if necessary.


Thanks Jamie

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Re: Wanted 1m Version Mat cutter

Post by Justintime » Wed 05 Jun, 2019 12:44 pm

Have you tried Peter at Framers equipment?

ShutterLIVING
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Re: Wanted 1m Version Mat cutter

Post by ShutterLIVING » Wed 05 Jun, 2019 1:51 pm

HI thanks for the response, and no, I have been to the site before. Do they do second-hand?
Will send peter a mssage.

...thanks for the tip @Justintime

Will be back with he outcome.

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Re: Wanted 1m Version Mat cutter

Post by Ed209 » Wed 05 Jun, 2019 5:31 pm

I have a 1200mm just become available perfect condition cuts precisely across its whole length £850 (please note stock photo) will take photos of actual item soon or on request. ( very busy sorting new shop)Image


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ShutterLIVING
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Re: Wanted 1m Version Mat cutter

Post by ShutterLIVING » Wed 05 Jun, 2019 5:45 pm

Thank you thanks you Ed209 unfortunately I can only fit the 40inch version.
Anyone got the smaller one that they don’t need?
Jamie

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Re: Wanted 1m Version Mat cutter

Post by Justintime » Wed 05 Jun, 2019 9:01 pm

Just a thought Jamie.
These mount cutters come with two cutting blades. One for cutting a window bevel and one to cut down whole sheets of mountboard to size.
If you look at the standard size of a sheet of mountboard, you'll see that a 1m mount cutter is limited in its usefulness and as such is not a popular choice.

ShutterLIVING
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Re: Wanted 1m Version Mat cutter

Post by ShutterLIVING » Thu 06 Jun, 2019 6:33 am

You make an excellent point Justintime
One that I hope you can give me some clarity on?

I will send further info in an hour or so....

Photos of my workspace
Reason for buying cutter
Size of mats I will be expecting to cut.
My existing Rotatrim T650.
Standard size of mat board deliver from the supplier that I will need to cut to size.
Maximum mat size of the 40inch version vs the 48inch version.
Number of mat cutters on the second hand market in both sizes
Other manufacturers than keencut?... valiani?
Where to by other than eBay

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Re: Wanted 1m Version Mat cutter

Post by ShutterLIVING » Thu 06 Jun, 2019 10:43 am

My work-space is small, 3mx3m and its primary roll is as a darkroom.
I'm not a framer, more a photographer wanting to frame my work.
The vast majority of work will be printed on 16x20 and maybe 20x24 inch paper (with images sizes of 14.5 inch x 21.5inch and 13inch x 19.5inch) .
So I will need to procure mats for these sized prints. (I like large boarders though)
I have a rotatrim T650 (shown in a photo) that can cut down boards, its maximum cut length is 800mm (...is this big enough for full size uncut mat boards)?
The mat cutter will have to be stored when not in use and my thoughts was the 40inch version would be better in the space I have.
Do you think it would be versatile or the framing I wish to do?

...thanks in advance.
Jamie
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Re: Wanted 1m Version Mat cutter

Post by Justintime » Thu 06 Jun, 2019 11:30 am

Are you sure that your Rotatrim T650 cuts up to 800mm and not 650mm??
My standard mountboard from Larson Juhl is 815mmx1120mm as is Daler mountboard.
Moving a mountboard cutter each time you use it will require time as you will have to check the calibration/squareness each time it is re setup.
I have seen them mounted on the wall and used vertically, with a suitable wooden frame constructed to hold it in place, if wall space is an option?
My advice would be to find a large framers who have a CMC, you can supply the mountboard and they will cut the mounts for you at a cost which when you take into account materials, your labour and wastage won't work out much more expensive.
It shouldn't be underestimated how much wastage is involved in learning how to use this cutter and I admit, the mistakes that occur on a regular basis.
If you're short on space, imagine storing a pack or two of standard mountboard, that must be kept in pristine condition, then imagine storing the fallouts for future use on smaller pieces, the offcuts used for slips under the mount when cutting and dealing with all of the scrap offcuts/wastage, oh and a little space to store the tool kit, blades and cleaning product.

ShutterLIVING
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Re: Wanted 1m Version Mat cutter

Post by ShutterLIVING » Thu 06 Jun, 2019 1:14 pm

Are you sure that your Rotatrim T650 cuts up to 800mm and not 650mm??

A: Pic attached

My standard mountboard from Larson Juhl is 815mmx1120mm as is Daler mountboard.

A: good to know and also a little annoying, Ill look online to see if I can find them at 800mm

Moving a mountboard cutter each time you use it will require time as you will have to check the calibration/squareness each time it is re setup.

A: good to know. I will factor that in.


I have seen them mounted on the wall and used vertically, with a suitable wooden frame constructed to hold it in place, if wall space is an option?

A: Wow, interesting i never know that could be done. i will go a google search.


My advice would be to find a large framers who have a CMC, you can supply the mountboard and they will cut the mounts for you at a cost which when you take into account materials, your labour and wastage won't work out much more expensive.


A: im not necessarily doing this to save money, more to be able to be more creative and have 100% control of the whole process.

It shouldn't be underestimated how much wastage is involved in learning how to use this cutter and I admit, the mistakes that occur on a regular basis.

A: hmm OK, I think a course may be in order, I was in D&J Simons and i know they do a day intro course.

If you're short on space, imagine storing a pack or two of standard mountboard, that must be kept in pristine condition, then imagine storing the fallouts for future use on smaller pieces, the offcuts used for slips under the mount when cutting and dealing with all of the scrap offcuts/wastage, oh and a little space to store the tool kit, blades and cleaning product.

A: for me that sounds like a challenge in Tetris and studio design. I'm not sure what a pack of standard mount board looks like, but I will definitely find out when I am redesigning the other side of my studio. For me the ability to test different size mounts for different photos / make mistakes and keep going until i find a ratio that works for the individual image is why I want to dedicate the space and the cost.
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Re: Wanted 1m Version Mat cutter

Post by Justintime » Thu 06 Jun, 2019 2:41 pm

Sounds like I'm outvoted on the mount cutter on the wall idea...
https://www.theframersforum.com/viewtop ... 69&p=71909
I only asked because the Rotatrim T650 is 650mm and the T950 is 950mm! :lol:

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Re: Wanted 1m Version Mat cutter

Post by Steve N » Fri 07 Jun, 2019 7:08 am

justintime wrote
"My standard mountboard from Larson Juhl is 815mmx1120mm as is Daler mountboard."


My Daler is 815x1200mm
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http://www.frontierpictureframes.com
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Re: Wanted 1m Version Mat cutter

Post by ShutterLIVING » Fri 07 Jun, 2019 8:39 am

OK - yup the T650 appears to be so named according to its cut length. (Contrary to my measuring tape)

Sooooo, I will need to use the straight cut on the Keencut or equivalent.
It seems though the 40inch will still be able to make the initial cut of the board?

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Re: Wanted 1m Version Mat cutter

Post by Justintime » Fri 07 Jun, 2019 11:10 am

Yes that makes sense.
Like I said, Peter at Framers Equipment in Northampton would be worth speaking to.

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Re: Wanted 1m Version Mat cutter

Post by Not your average framer » Fri 07 Jun, 2019 11:14 am

I can sympathise with your lack of space, as I have a very small shop as well. To be able to operate in such small premises , I have no choice, but to use the front of my shop as also my workshop area and have my Morso, mountcutter, System 4000 wallmounted board / glass cutter and underpinner all in the main shop area. I would readily admit that it's not ideal, but my customers accept things as they are and nobody says anything about it.

If this works for me, maybe you could consider something similar. Like I said, it not ideal, but it might not be as bad as you may be thinking.
Mark Lacey

“Life is short. Art long. Opportunity is fleeting. Experience treacherous. Judgement difficult.”
― Geoffrey Chaucer

ShutterLIVING
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Re: Wanted 1m Version Mat cutter

Post by ShutterLIVING » Fri 07 Jun, 2019 11:50 am

Hey Mark,
Quick question what size of mat cutter do you use?
It sounds like your shop is workable, that is the main thing. I think with certain limitations comes creativity in design.

(...that's what I keen telling myself).

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Re: Wanted 1m Version Mat cutter

Post by Not your average framer » Sat 08 Jun, 2019 6:40 am

My mountcutter is the Keencut Ultimat Gold 48 inch model. It resides on a kitchen work top type counter and larger mounts overhang the counter top. For really larger mounts, I have a pair of keencut support arms, but rarely use them. I am happy to cut one, or two mounts while customers wait and customers find it interesting to watch me cutting their mounts. I even make the odd ready made frame while customers wait as well. Customers find watching me working an interesting and enjoyable experience and I quite happily answer their questions about how, or why things are done. I'm not secretive about how I do things, but like them to ask questions, which I consider as being a good thing for business.

Almost all of my moulding stock is plain wood which I hand finish to suit what customers require, I obviously have a display of suppliers factory finished sample as well, but I only stock a limited amount of factory finished mouldings and these are particularly necessary for quick ready made frames. There are occasions when customers want a particular colour, or finish that I don't have a sample for and when necessary I'll grab a small scrap from the waste bin and produce a sample while they wait and work to that sample, when I get round to doing their framing. Why am I telling you this, well when customers can see you working, it's a good thing, not a bad thing and customer do recognise craftmanship when they see it.

Some customers have indicated to me, that they appreciate being able to talk directly to the framer instead, of just a sales assistant. This is especially true for customers who want needlework framed and are concerned to know that you know what you are doing and how it is going to look. Nearly all my mountboard stock is of conservation standard and I work to conservation standards, with full reversibility as my normal working practice. Not everyone wants conservation quality glass, but everything else is up to conservation level, unless they choose a mountboard colour that is only a white spec and if this is so this is explained to them before accepting the order.

Customers seeing me working in the shop gives me the perfect opportunity to talk them through some of my own personal preferences and why I like to do things the way that I do. There are some mountboard colours and finishes, which to me are not as visually appealing as I know that they can be and particularly if this is not the front mount of double, or triple mount, I will hand finish the visible part of that mount myself. There's a real difference between something that's o.k. and something that's stunning and I like to create expectations. I am based in a relatively small to medium sized rural town and one characteristic of rural areas is people spend time visiting each other and their friends get to see my work, making each job an advert for my shop.

I'm certainly not losing out by having an old fashioned looking tightly packed small shop and perhaps it might work for you too. In an age when shops are looking like they were designed and organised on a computer, every shop you go into is a clone of every other sho. Well, I never was in that mould and neither is my shop, it was not planned that way, it's something that has grown organically and the result is just how it turned out. I never expected people to say so, but people tell me the love my old fashioned looking shop. I know I keep saying this, but I really do believe that there are very real advantages in being different in good ways and not just a copy of what you see everywhere else.

Don't be afraid to be different and do your own thing, it works!
Mark Lacey

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― Geoffrey Chaucer

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Re: Wanted 1m Version Mat cutter

Post by red » Sat 08 Jun, 2019 2:21 pm

If customers see you doing their work its adds to everything really.I used to do craft fairs many years
ago .When a stallholder made their wres in front of the public,there was far more interest and sales too
small is beautiful!

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Re: Wanted 1m Version Mat cutter

Post by Not your average framer » Sat 08 Jun, 2019 4:30 pm

I think so too.
Mark Lacey

“Life is short. Art long. Opportunity is fleeting. Experience treacherous. Judgement difficult.”
― Geoffrey Chaucer

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Re: Wanted 1m Version Mat cutter

Post by lawrieh » Wed 19 Jun, 2019 2:30 pm

hi
I wasn't thinking of selling it but I may consider selling my Keencut 40" Arrow. See pictures attached.

You will notice I have attached two eyes to the top and it hangs against the wall when I am not using it, (something you may want to consider if you buy one from someone else). I actually also have a Keencut ultimat and I find the Arrow produces better results and is easier to use.

I am London Based, if you want to have a look PM me.

Lawrie

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