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Hi, am I over thinking this? Say I measure some artwork and want a 50mm border, so calculate the overall glass size. The frame has a rebate width of 5 mm.
I set my cutter to 50mm, but once in the frame only 45mm border is visible.
Should I actually be adding on the rebate width to the cut measurement? Cutting 55mm so the whole 50mm border is visible, and making the glass size 5mm bigger all round to compensate?
When you're measuring your design on the table with artwork, mount chevron and moulding, stick your ruler under the moulding rebate and measure back to the bevel edge of the mount. This will give you the mount width that you require. Add 2mm on to your glass size for the frame size. If you're not using software, I suggest writing down Image Size, Mount Width, Glass Size and Frame Size, to reduce costly mistakes.
Think of it as two different named versions of the measurement. You have the mount border size, and the visible border size. As Justin says, you can check the rebate depth of the moulding to see what the difference in those would be.
We tend to just use the terminology with customers of mount border size, knowing that some of it will be hidden away under the rebate and taking that into account when choosing the border size at the design desk with the customer. But we have one gallery we work for who specify "visible border size" to make sure they are getting the visual look they are after.
The other benefit from your viewpoint is that if you are selling a 55mm mount border (equivalent to say 50mm visible border), then it is a bigger frame overall, so more money in the till.
Jo Palmer GCF(APF) Adv
Textile, Mount Design & Function & Conservation
Forum Moderator & Framing Educator www.pictureframingtraining.com
Guild Certified Examiner & Guild Accredited Trainer
Guild Chair & Master May 2019 to May 2022
See attached drawing as an example (not to scale).
The visible art is 800 x 500.
The visible mount is 50 all round.
Another 3mm of mount fits under the rebate.
So the overall size to cut both the mount and the glass is 906 x 606.
You may know this already but the glass/mount/undermount "sandwich" should not fit too tightly inside the frame.
I place a moulding chevron on the mount chevron and ask customers to decide visually how wide they want the mount to be. Once they've decided on the visual width they want, I measure from under the rebate to the bevelled edge of the mount.
In practice very few customers would be able to tell the difference between a 50mm mount and a 47mm mount. But I seem to remember one forum member posting a few years ago about a customer who complained that the mount was not the size he expected due to the rebate taking up some of it and it caused a problem. So you do right to check.
I have always been measuring from the back of rebate in front of customers, but last night had a huge brain melt. That if I had measured 50, said 50 and written 50 down, whether 50 should actually be visible and that I was doing it all wrong.
One little thing, I have been measuring to the back of the bevel on the underside. Justin and Rainbow, do you mean you measure to the front of the bevel or am I reading that wrong?
I don't understand the question, the underside? Anyway, unless they're an artist/gallery (as Jo said) who explicitly request a visible width, that 50 figure you say out loud is just for your design spec, to the customer it is just "that much".
From what you say, I think you know what you are doing, it is as simple as it seems
WannabeFramer wrote: Wed 19 Jul, 2023 2:27 pm
One little thing, I have been measuring to the back of the bevel on the underside. Justin and Rainbow, do you mean you measure to the front of the bevel or am I reading that wrong?
I think you're asking "do you measure to the edge of the facing paper, before the bevel starts, or do you include the width of the bevel". Tbh I'm not that precise, and I can't think of any customer who has been interested in a precise measurement either. Mostly they're not that sure what looks right anyway and they leave it to me to fine tune the width of the mount. As long as I don't give them a wide mount when they really wanted a narrow one, then all is well!
That if I had measured 50, said 50 and written 50 down, whether 50 should actually be visible and that I was doing it all wrong. 
