The Framers Forum

How exactly do you go about framing a A2 poster that has no mount and going up against the glass.
My thoughts are to hinge mount on to same size mount board (back of) by passing the hinge tap across the top edge and anchor down on the back of the mount board.
Or as above direct on to 2.5 MDF but with thin barrier board between


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Where the backing board is held in place by the framing points, or tabs, which penetrate into the frame rebate, there is not a lot of give and the edges of a poster which goes all the way to the inside edges of the frame are clamping the edges of the poster. This presents a particular problem, because any expansion, or contraction of the poster due to changes in humidity, or temperature can't be relieved by the edges of the poster having the opportunity to move. The likely result will be that the poster will ripple, buckle, or cockle.

It is therefore advisable to provided something thin which is hidden from sight by the sight edge of the frame, which prevents the edges of the poster being restrained by this clamping action, but the thickness of this something does not want to be to much thicker than the thickness of the poster. This something should have an aperture slightly large than the outside edges of the poster, so that the poster can move a little without causing the poster to ripple, buckle, or cockle. At the same time, any gap between the edges of the poster need to be hidden by the frames sight edge.

I like most other mere mortals, prefer to suggest to the owner of the poster that dry mounting is a good solution. The problem with dry mounting is that dry mounting is not an easily reversible process and not a good thing to do if the poster is valuable as a collectors item. Which brings us back to why mounting the poster with a mount and an undermount, may still be the wisest course of action, with no reversiiblity issues. Is there a particular reason why the customer does not want a mount?

You can mount a poster without it looking as though the frame has a mount.

The thing is the make the mount very skinny, or use a wideish slip. Works better if the frame is reasonably wide.

Say a 3" flat, black moulding with a 1" mount. the mount will relate more to the frame than the art.

This will allow you to hinge the poster to a board in the traditional manner. The sneaky part is that you lift the mount/slip
slightly so that it does not crimp the poster edges. I use linen tape for this, sliced to about 6mm wide.
Say the mount/slip is 30mm wide. You have 6mm of tape, a gap of maybe 3mm and the poster edge. Of course you can jiggle
these dimensions to suit the situation, but the main thing is the poster is unrestricted.

I grabbed this off Grumble the other day....
It's a vellum certificate which would be more susceptible to moisture than paper so the effect is extreme.
But it does serve to illustrate what will happen to a sheet of paper that is crimped around it's perimeter.

I suspect that the customer might not want a slip, (which is one of the most sensible solutions), but there are a few frame mouldings which have wider that usual rebates and may permit the strip of fabric tape, or some other suitable element a little thicker than the paper to be hidden. Unfortunately, many such frames with wider rebates can turn out to be not what the customer has in mind.

There is this thing about poster frames being as narrow as possible and wide rebates don't tend to be available in narrow frame mouldings. I don't have a lot of success pursading customers to consider using a slip in conjunction with a poster. Many of them want the poster to be framed to look like posters in the entrance to a cinema and consequently the slip does not give them the same look.

My personal preference for poster framing is a wide, flat moulding and hardly any mount at all. After all, a poster
is essentially a 'flat' image and a throwaway item. It doesn't need to be treated with the same design as a watercolour.
Without using a slip or narrow mount a wide moulding does allow you to widen the rebate - albeit with some woodworking kit.
Table saw or router table.Widen the rebate to say, 15mm gives you 4mm for the tape + 4mm gap leaving 7mm to tuck the poster
under.
Just my take on the subject.

Of course the simplest way is to drymount it and slip blind spacers under the rebate. acceptable on replaceable posters.

Just had a proper look at posters he collects them from the when he goes to the concerts and each design is exclusive to each venue and dates.

They are on quite thick paper one more so than the other, He does not want a mount as they are to match others he has had done previously by other framers. The moulding as seen in photos is what he wants and only a 6 mm rebate.

I suppose I could router the rebate wider, This mount less poster issue seems a problem that no one has yet come up with a ready made solution for, I also have six UK Quad cinema posters to frame they also don't want a mount and a narrow black moulding I have also read on past postings that Acrylic Plastic Glass is preferable at this size but a lot more expensive.

I want to do a good professional job but not out price myself

Setting up and routing is quite time consuming with a risk of damaging mouldings and lossing fingers

Since these posters are obviously collectors items, then it follows that the future value of these items suggests proper conservation / preservation framing, which also suggests UV blocking glass. Contact between the poster and the glass is now also an issue and a slip, or a mount needs to be considered by the customer to keep the poster away from the glass.

He is quite insistent that he wants then framed exactly like previous ones but I will try and see if I can somehow do as you and others have suggested by allowing room for wiggle but its going to be a challenge with only 6mm rebate

You just can't reason with some people.

If the posters are potentially future collector's items then a potential buyer will want them in as near pristine condition
as possible. Any defect will effect the value considerably. Bunging them in a frame against the glass puts them at risk.
But he's the boss and if he won't listen to good advice then that's his lookout.

I had a similar wrangle with a (very fussy) chap once. He had two glossy 20x30" photos. Didn't want a mount and wanted as
narrow a frame as poss. I told him they needed a mount or they would go waaavy. He persisted. So I said they wouldn't go wavy
if I drymounted them, but because they were glossies they would tend to show a bit of orange-peel texture.
He went for the drymount option.
When he came to collect them he remarked that they looked a bit bumpy from certain angles.
I replied that I said they would. To which he had no further comment.

End of story.

Ed209 wrote:its going to be a challenge with only 6mm rebate

I would not bother trying, 6mm is much smaller than what you need to make it work.

I would cut an undermount the same size as the artwork and just sit poster on top without fixing it.
Then use econospace to keep the poster away from the glass.

To come from another point of view...get the customer to sign a formal looking thing to say that you've explained all the risks of framing it the way they want it done and you don't accept any responsibility for future damage or loss of value.

At worst you're back is covered, at best the customer realises that there is a serious risk of damage and looks at other options...

Think its very easy to take conservation too far. The customer has said what they want, specifically to match existing. I think its important to make sure that you are not appearing to be too pushy with the conservation side of things and coming across as trying to upsell. Simply inform them of the correct way to do it and then frame it how they want.

Funnily enough I had one of those prints in last week....window mounted.

louisesimon wrote
"Think its very easy to take conservation too far. The customer has said what they want, specifically to match existing. I think its important to make sure that you are not appearing to be too pushy with the conservation side of things and coming across as trying to upsell. Simply inform them of the correct way to do it and then frame it how they want."

Hooray! exactly what I was thinking , you've (OP) told him the 'Best Practise Method ' but he wants done his way, take the money and frame the posters, if you get him to sign a formal looking document about not taking your advice, that will antagonise him and it will be that last you will see of him, just grin and bear it ( and count the money)

Oh, I was under the impression they were valuable and the customer wanted them preserved.

Absolutely agree, if the customer's not bothered about conservation neither am I. Got enough to do without doing extra work where it's not needed or wanted!

Hi

I have a similar issue: Large 120 x 70 cm photographs - worth an obscene amount of money.

Previous works done in the US for the photographer are float mounted - or at least mounted without having a top mount and set back from the glass by around 1.8cm. frame is centrado 9715wh.

I like the econospace idea - but not really deep enough.

I could make foam board spacers on my CMC but will this be good enough to hold without rippling?

I may decide this is out of my depth given the high cost of the items. ( Small car price each!)

any advice appreciated as usual.

Cheers

MAtt

Ed209 wrote:He is quite insistent that he wants then framed exactly like previous ones but I will try and see if I can somehow do as you and others have suggested by allowing room for wiggle but its going to be a challenge with only 6mm rebate

Has any of his other posters rippled?
Explain its not best practice but do what the customer asked for, dont clip it in too tight, sometimes thats all you can do, given a customers requirements and budget.