(All together now....) "Wrinkles in My Drymounts...

[Moglet]

... made a loser out of me."

All fun aside, the major ]problem I've had with my heatpress is creasing. So much so, that I prefer to cold mount onto self-adhesive board and use the vacuum function than heat mount anything "risky."

I don't have a glass-topped press (make/model is Biedermann Profi LIne), so once the switch is flicked, I'm working 'blind.' I've tried using a sheet of release paper bonded to mountboard (per my Irish supplier's suggestion) to counteract the problem, but to no guaranteed avail.

Any tips on where I'm going wrong? It's a problem I'd really like to solve, because I might then get better use from the press.

[Dermot]

May help.... http://www.pictureframingmagazine.com/p ... artbas.pdf

And have a look here.... http://www.drytac.com/techhelp.asp

[Dermot]

Play the Video http://h10088.www1.hp.com/cda/gap/displ ... 46_4000_33__

http://h10088.www1.hp.com/gap/download/pdf_acrylic.pdf

http://www.hotpress.co.uk/Hints.pdf

[prospero]

Can you describe these wrinkles in more detail? Or post a piccy?

Are you using a foam blanket?

[Bill Henry]

Also, what kind of "paper" material are you trying to bond? Posters? Maps? Photos?

Are you pre-drying the material before squishing it in the press?

[Moglet]

Thanks for replies, people.

No pics, unfortunately, but if you can imagine the crease left by pressing the side of your nail into a sheet of foamcore and running it along the surface, that's the problem I have had (mounting onto mountboard and onto foamcore, btw).

Problem has happened on both porous (e.g. prints, etc) and non-porous (e.g. photographic) media.

Yes, there is a blanket in the press, but I put it under the drymount sandwich (i.e. covering the diaphragm of the press). For right or wrong, that's what I was told to do. On my supplier's recommendation, I started using a sheet of mountboard between the heated platen and the top sheet of silicon release paper.

In answer to your question, Bill, I've not tried pre-drying the substrates, although I usually press the artwork to flatten it before making up the sandwich. I've read some of Dermot's links (v. helpful - thankyou!), and I haven't had problems with bubbles, just the creasing.

Some addtional info (don't know whether it will be helpful): I have tried both silicon release paper and silicon release film in the press, and the film was an absolute b*gger for creasing.

[Not your average framer]

Hi Aine,

These days most of my dry mounting is done with Hot press easymount pre-coated board or one of the pre-coated foamboards, so I don't need to use dry mount tissue. I do this because it's cheaper and less fuss to do. It might be a solution to your problem.

Actually now I come to think about it, a there any creases in your foam blanket. They don't last forever and I've had to change mine from time to time when it's no longer up to the job.

[prospero]

Hmmmmmmm.... Foam blanket under the sandwich. Well that's a new one on me. I always use it on top.

From the bottom up..... Release paper shiny up. Sandwich. Release paper shiny down. Foam.

The only time I have ever had creases like that is when I have tried to get a bit too much mileage out of the release paper. It don't last long.

I never thought of mounting it onto a board. I'll try that.

[Moglet]

Foam blanket under the sandwich. Well that's a new one on me.

This advice came from the same source as the following gem:

"You've got a Cassese underpinner: no need to glue your mitres. Besides, the excess glue would b*gger up the machine."

You're spot on about the look of the wrinkles: the release paper ends up creased as well. Thing is, it can happen with a completely fresh piece of release paper.

Mark, the blanket definitely doesn't have any creases in it. The press has not had that much use to date.

[WelshFramer]

I have a very old press. The rubber diaphragm is covered with felt. The artwork is placed on top of that, then the release film, then a foam blanket. Seems to work fine and I've never experience the problems you're having.

Keeping the release film crease free isn't exactly simple - it depends how it's handled. If you haven't seen it then it's well worth looking at the Hot Press DVD - it's £10 from Lion or free from Hot Press.

Something that's really worthwhile is attending one of the Hot Press training days. Steve Goodall should be able to tell you if there's one planned close to you although it might well be worth finding a cheap flight to Bristol. My experience is that they're quite happy to answer questions related to other makes of press as they make their money from selling film and adhesives.

[Moglet]

I have a very old press. The rubber diaphragm is covered with felt*. The artwork is placed on top of that, then the release film, then a foam blanket.

* (emphasis mine.
Aha! Maybe what I have thought of as a "foam blanket" is actually a felt protective cover for the diaphragm. If so, then no I don't have a foam blanket...

Any chance of some pics of the two so that I can compare, Mike?

I'd love to go to a HotPress training day. Trouble is that they tend to be held on the Eastern side of the country. Maybe when I start driving again (some day...), I'll get to go on one. In the meantime, the DVD sounds like a great idea. I really would like to get more benefit from the press.

[prospero]

Get a foam blanket and you'll never look back. They come in two thicknesses. The thinner ones are for vac presses.
I got a foam blanket and I never looked back. I daren't look back because of the giant lizards that follows me about///////

[Comet]

Hello Moglet,
For drymounting, the layers are 1 bottom foam blanket. 2 substrate . 3 drymount tissue or drymount film. 4 poster or whatever you want to mount, and the top layer is silicone release film, or silicone release paper.

The foam blanket goes on top of the vacuum press diaphragm.

I think your problem is with your foam blanket, its creased or worn out.

The Hotpress DVD that someone mentioned is availabe on YouTube,

Go to YouTube and put HOTPRESS999 in the search box, I tried to post the link but it wont work.

For HeatSealing, the layers are reversed, with the silicone release paper/film on the bottom on top of the press diaphragm, with the foam blanked on top of the sandwich.

HotPress have put all of the DVD on YouTube so take a look.

[Steve N]

Hi Moglet,
What happens sometime is the outer edge of the work/tissue starts to stick before the centre of the work, so the tissue will move and wrinkle, so you need to stop the outer edges sticking first, give this a try.
Starting from the bottom up foam blanket, then then the backing, tissue, work on top, then release film and then a sheet of 1.5 -2mm plastic on top, rub your hands along the the upper surface of the plastic to push out any air, then put the top down , switch on, should cure it, this the way I've been doing it for about 7 years 95% rate of success.

Steve

[Martin Harrold]

Some quick thoughts:

- is your press pulling the vacuum quickly? Once the pump clears the bulk of the air, it should pull the vacuum almost instantly. Otherwise, you can suffer from the type of problem described by Steve N. If it's slow to pull, rub your finger all around the rubber seal - feel for any muck or cuts which can cause leakage. Does the vac gauge show a pressure approaching 27?

- how are you positioning your work? There are three choices, tacking iron, pritt stick or spraymount. Whichever you use, only do it in one place, not two or more. If you use two or more, the differential contraction or expansion of the various materials in the sandwich may cause wrinkles.

- I recall that it's damp in the West. Depending upon your work area and how you store your board, it may be damp. When your press is warm, lay the board in it with the lid part ajar. Leave it for 5 minutes or so. Don't over dry as you may get other problems later when it re-absorbs atmospheric moisture.

If you get any problems with the Biederman press, I do know Hr Biederman quite well and can give you his contact details. He speaks good English.

[Steve Goodall]

I am over in Ireland in March - at Sisslings on 6th / 7th / 8th then at Scopas on 12th / 13th doing Hot Press drop in days - lots of demonstrations / problem solving / special offers / free catalogues & DVDs - it would be lovely to see you & get to the bottom of your problem...

[Moglet]

Steve, much as I'd love to get to one of the open days, there's no way I can make the trip at the moment. It would be really nice to meet you. Such a pity...

[Bill Henry]

(All together now....)
"Wrinkles in My Drymounts...
Staples in my thumb,
Spittle on my mat board,
Acrylic’s got a flumb.

Catchy tune!

[Moglet]

Thread title and opening line were inspired by this particular ditty....

Yee-hah!

[Townsend]

For what it is worth Aine I frequently have the problem you describe, especially with photographs but also with certain prints and posters. At this stage I warn my customers that dry mounting is never 100% predictable, but that most problems can be overcome subsequently by heat sealing the item if a problem occurs. Heat sealing can be seen as your getout clause.