Parking Wars

[Roboframer]

We have a big parking problem in our lickle village.

There are plenty of spaces - it's just that they are taken by idle inconsiderate shop employees, even business owners. Customers, unless they are lucky, have to drive around the village looking for an on-street space and walk in. Many of course just keep going, I, and many others are definitely not able to operate to our full potential because the great resource of free parking is abused.

It's a stupid situation and over the years I've almost come to blows with some of the (insert plural expletive here) .............

The police are useless too - the only person I've ever known get a ticket for staying over the time in a restricted bay, was my DeMontfort rep! But a letter will be winging its way to the local Chief Inspector tomorrow, demanding to know why (again)

Anyway, I'm writing a letter to all the shops and businesses in the village - and if that does not work then I'm going to use my windows and the patio in front of them to good effect - "Difficulty Parking? Well, these are the people stopping you - and here's their contact details should you wish to complain, and here's a petition to sign saying you won't patronise them if they don't pack it in, and a list of their nearest competitors" - etc etc etc.

In addition, when I see a car looking for a space, when there are none, i'll ask the driver where s/he wants to get to. If it's my shop I'll point out which cars can be blocked in, as they won't be going anywhere until 5:30! If it's most any other shop I'll say "Well, see those 2 (or whatever) cars there? They belong to the staff of that shop, do you still want to give them your custom?"

In case you've not guessed I am MAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAD


Here's my last attempt letter - what do you think? (bits in red are explanatory notes)


AN IDEA TO HELP BEAT THE RECESSION!

Please don’t take customer parking whilst at work, or allow your staff to.

We have the following 26 marked bays in the village:-

9 on Arundel road, (chip shop 4, vets 3, dentists 2; all restricted to one hour.)

17 in front of the main row of shops, (8 unrestricted, 8 restricted to one hour and one disabled.)

Free parking, bang outside the shops, is a great resource that should be taken maximum advantage of; instead the bays are choked with local employees and residents. Not just residents who live above the shops – they are not a problem, but residents from Church Road, Station Road and the High Street, who cannot park outside or near to their homes because of local employees.

I realise that Chandlers (BMW Dealership 110 employees bain of local residents' life - not just on-street parking - 2 am deliveries etc etc) are the biggest problem on the High Street and they also park at the bottom of church road and in the spaces to the right of the Lamb. (pub) But at least Chandlers’ workforce has it in their employee handbook that they are not to take customer parking bays in the village centre.

I make the same conditions on my staff; not just to stay out of marked bays but to stay out of the village centre altogether, so as not to force residents in to marked bays. The village isn’t a huge place, no matter where they manage to find a space they rarely have to walk more than 2 minutes to work.

By doing this I am not only helping my own business, but also yours. You, and/or your staff (if the cap fits) by the same token, by parking outside the shops, are not just hindering your own business! (you're hindering mine and you can look out after this! )
I realise parking is a problem, but I make it their problem instead of my customers’ problem and I’m asking you to do the same. I’m not prepared to pay a wage to a person that prevents customers getting to the shops.

Are you?

[Bill Henry]

It seems like your idea is the best way to handle the situation and get to know your neighbors, too. Getting the police involved would probably be pointless since you don’t want your customers to be ticketed.

Is there enough off-street parking for all the owners and employees, though?

… and, of course, although tempting, vigilante justice should be a last resort

… and done after midnight if at all possible.

[Jonny2morsos]

I am looking at new premises and the Landlord has made it plain from the outset that all parking is for customers only (written in lease terms) and is prepared to terminate a lease if lessees abuse the agreement.

John.

[markw]

Sadly John the only way you will achieve the result you want is by charging for the car parking space. Now that would seem an extreme answer to the problem when a little intelligent cooperation from your neighbours would solve the problem.

If the situation is similar to my ickle village then the problem often goes deeper than local shop owners and employees using up "customer" space. We actually got people parking and being picked up to travel on to other places just because they knew the parking was free. Others were office workers who had no interest in local trade.
This is apparently a common problem and some councils have applied what seems to be a good solution - Ticketed parking - you take a ticket from the machine for say 1 hours free parking - stay over the hour and you have to pay.

Obviously the preferred solution is free parking and the local businesses taking an intelligent view of your proposal - I rate your chances as low - people can be amazingly lazy when it comes to parking their cars. Fortunately I have nice zig zag lines outside my shop - they are a special parking zone for fourwheel drive owners.

[kev@frames]

the way to partly ease the shoppers parking problem is one they use round here - its not ideal but its better than nothing.
Much of the on-street parking is restricted to one hour between 8am and 5pm. monday to saturday, This leaves most residents parking available overnight, and they are off to work in their cars daytime anyway.
that deals with the commuters who park up all day.

They (council) have still not grasped that most of the year the car parks are virtually empty, and the streets clogged with cars. It doesn't take too much brainwater to figure that people dont like to pay the parking charges -which in our town are not ridiculuous compared to some, but obviously they mount up for people working in town paying for 200 all day car park tickets a year or a £400 a year annual permit.

It would need some concerted lobbying, maybe with the chamber of commerce and your local councillor(s).

Parking is an issue for all shops in town centres now, and too much parking enforcement can often drive people away. You only need a customer to get a parking ticket outside your shop once and he'll think again before coming next time, twice and you have probably lost a customer.
However, in west cornwall, motorcycles park free - but not many bikers take picture frames home on their bikes

[Moglet]

Parking is an issue for all shops in town centres now...

Ain't it just. Two decisions have had a definite impact on trade since I opened:

1. Building of a new block with retail units and apartments on top of the most central car park in the town.

2. Tesco's opened just on the edge of town.

It's either a feast or a famine. The early part of the week, there is less customer activity than when I first opened (true in pre-downturn days), and on busier days people get frelled off that they can't find any parking places in the town centre.

[Roboframer]

Most of the marked bays, as per my letter, are restricted to one hour, but they are rarely/never enforced. So paying to park would not work either - no-one would enforce it. Customers would pay, sure, they don't know they have more chance of being abducted by aliens, like I was that one time, than of getting a ticket.

In fact that could put them off coming here, but it would not deter an idle SOB who has no problem parking on a yellow line all day anyway!

I've put a hold on my letter and the one to the filth.

Pat, who is on the Parish Council, has a very useful email address book! Direct to the Head inspector at our nearest nick, etc. Now she tells me.

The Co-op and PO, which is about the same size as our place and at the opposite end of our row ('strip' to Bill) are having a re-fit and their contractors' vehicles, plus their staffs', as usual, are all in the one hour bays all day, have been for weeks.

Used one of Pat's email addresses last night and today the cops were down - no tickets - just told 'em all to sod off!

Enforcement is the only way - and I'm not concerned about my customers, or, especially anyone else's getting ticketed. The signs say they have an hour - not me. One hour not enough? Fine - park on street or in an unrestricted bay.

Also - looking at the type of shops we have, that letter is a waste of time - but I do want to vent though!

Here's what I'm up against

Newsagent - couldn't give one - their customers are in and out in a flash - park on double yellows, double park even when there are bays empty, block my driveway.

Haidressers (x3) - well, they know from their appointment book how many bums (that's 'butts', Bill) they will have in chairs on any given day. They have to find somewhere to park.

Dentists. See hairdressers.

Estate agents (x1 - was x2 but one went - hahahaha!) mostly go to the client and not vice versa.

Electrical shop. No-one goes there, it's a front for a bigger operation.

Gen store & Po - National chain (Co-op) - staff couldn't give one.

Chip shop. Most trade in the evening - see newsagent!

Portugese cafe - struggling - but the owner has 2 cars in customer parking bays with 'for sale' signs in!

Off licence - national chain - see co-op!

Charity shop, next door to me - he's with me 100% - he and I have the only retail premiises that customers can browse in.

I attract customers from Waaaaaaaaaaaaay outside the area and it galls me that some of these other A-holes benefit from them and the advertising I pay for to get them.

[markw]

If we see the headline "phantom tyre (thats tire Bill) slasher hits Angerming" we wont say a word.

[Not your average framer]

We've got double yellow lines and a traffic warden who has to divide his time between 6 or 7 small towns which are well spaced out, so he can't be here very often or for very long. In the summer, he's probably stuck in traffic somewhere. It's surprising how quickly our customers can switch to appearing to be loading or unloading when he shows up. Others just drive round the block and come back, by which time he's further down the road.

One think I like in paticular, is he get his own dedicated "Police parking space". So customers drive past the space first to see if he's in town and if not they park anywhere they like! I don't think he has much luck booking the locals and has to wait for an unsuspecting grockle or two.

[prospero]

There was an interesting bit in one of those cop-clip progs about BT vans in Harringey. (Why does all the sh*t happen there?) BT employ a man whoose only job is to spring BT vans that have been towed from the pound. He averages about 7-8 a day. Record 26. He has a BT credit card to pay the fines with - £100+ a pop. The card has 10K limit and more often than not goes over the limit by the month end. We are all paying indirectly for this via our phone bills.

There seems to be a trend just lately of town councils flogging off car parks for building land. OK, it brings in a bit of short-term revenue, but then they wonder why there are lots of empty shops in the area. Just done this in Lincoln. Two carparks that have been there for years. One now has a museum on it. One has an 'arts' centre. They don't get many visitors.

Have you noticed there are always lots of parking spaces when you are on foot?

[Roboframer]

Today the co-op 'manager' well 'A' manager, just some spotty kid, (we know him quite well) had his citroen in an unrestricted bay at 9 am - had probably been there since his shop opened at 7. I've spoken to him about parking outside and the best he can come up with is 'Well, I'm not the only one!"

The co-op have a side drive that will hold about 6 cars; their predecesors (who this manager used to work for and was never allowed to park outside in those days) 'Londis' - a franchise, (IOW the business owner was always on site) not only used to park in that drive but also offered space to other business employees/owners after about 10 am when they had had their daily delivery; that delivery came in a van.

The co-op also have their daily delivery before 10 am - but in a HUGE HGV that causes absolute chaos reversing up that drive ..... and then unloads about three push-cages!

Don't get me started on National chains in small villages.

OK - it would be fair enough to keep the drive empty until after the delivery, as long as the staff moved their cars up there straight after, but no, that's just too much trouble.

11:30 and (let's call him) Kevin's car is still there - so I went and got a piece of mountboard, about A2 and wrote, with a sharpie.......

"MY NAME IS KEVIN AND I AM THE DUTY MANAGER AT THE CO-OP
WE HAVE OUR OWN DRIVE AT THE SIDE OF OUR SHOP AND YOU CAN
SEE THAT IT IS EMPTY

I COULD PARK UP THERE BUT I JUST CAN'T BE BOTHERED

SAINSBURIES HAVE LOTS OF PARKING SPACES AND ARE JUST UP THE ROAD

HAVE A NICE DAY

I plonked it on his windscreen, small groups gathered to read it, I made sure I was one of those small groups a couple of times.

It was so much fun - Kevin eventually loped out of the store "I suppose you put that there" he said

"Yes I did Kevin" I said "I'll sign the .......ing thing if you want - and now I'm going to give you an opportunity to keep me off your CEO's back - you know, the guy who is so eager to 'work with local communities' (see the co-op's website) and the first thing I'll tell him is that I gave you that opportunity"

Swaggered off to raptuous applause .... well, some sniggers anyway.

[Moglet]

Go Citizen Turner! Freedom for Angmering!!!!

[prospero]

It may be my imagination, but I am begining to get a sneaking suspicion that Robo is just ever-so-slighty peeved about parking.

[markw]

Robo - I'me still called wolfy many years after objecting to something happening in our village. Be warned! it may be Robo objector.

[Roboframer]

This problem has been going on for years, well, forever actually.

When we first moved in the main row of spaces (Google earth my postcode - BN164EA) was just a lay-by - no marked bays.

The other spaces, (Dentist etc, mentioned in my letter above) did have marked bays and i hr restricted signs, but those bays could not be enforced as the signs were blue & white instead of black & white, and it would take a new traffic order to change them - we got them changed after about 2 years of constant harassment.

At the same time we tried to get the main row marked in to bays and restricted to 1 hour.

Oh no - can't do that - the road is an 'A' road and a higher turnaround of vehicles in these spaces would increase the risk of an accident INVOLVING PERSONAL INJURY (those are the catch words) - there were and are, always minor accidents caused by drivers reversing out of a space instead of driving out, after reversing in.

So I replied with - Hang on! - this area, a lay by in front of the shops & part of the highway, was put there for what? Shoppers? 'course it was, so, what you are saying is that if these spaces are used for the use YOU INTENDED them to be used for, they constitute a safety hazard - IOW, you have built a safety hazard! ??

Oh, well, a bypass is due in 300 years time, and then the road will be downgraded to a 'C' road and we can review the situation.

300 years passed - the bypass was built.

The bypass was built by a developer, as a condition of a 600 house bolt-on developement to our village.

Trouble was/is, the through-traffic wants to go West; this bypass passed the village to the East and spilled out on to the A259 over a mile further away to the East than the original 'rat run' did.

It's no bypass - developers do nothing for nothing - it's a very nice access route to already planned future developements! Trust me.

Aaaaanyway - computer says .... our through route is now a 'C' route, so, they made a new traffic order and painted marked bays - restricted just half of them to one hour - as some sort of protest I think - everywhere else (villages like ours with areas like this) have all bays restricted.

Well, that is, they TRIED!!

Thay chalked out the bays at an angle to the road, instead of 90 degrees; it's a 2 way road, plus they were far, far too narrow.

Mrs R sent the contractors packing - she picked up their traffic cones, threw them in the back of their truck and told them to - er - go away. I couldn't belive it - they actually legged it! Man I wished I'd had a video camera.

Long story - but anyway, they returned a month or so later and painted wider bays at right angles to the road, and put the restriction signs up. They also painted some yellow lines and put the signs up for those.

The signs - man, the signs!

Disabled bay sign, right on the kerb and 4ft in front of a lampost it could have simply been bolted to - third car in knocked it down and put it through the PO window.

Other signs also right by existing lamposts, yellow line signs in tree foliage - again right by existing telegraph poles, etc etc, that they could have just been bolted to - ye GODS!

We rang up and gave them hell - they came and removed all the new poles and bolted the signs to existing poles.

Aaah - now, let's sit back and wait for Angmering's first parking ticket.

Didn't happen.

Ah, well, you see, the signs and the position and width of the bays, no longer correspond to the traffic order, and therefore cannot be enforced.


AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAGH!

OK - now we have a traffic order to correspond with the bays and signs - but just that one PCSO to enforce them - when she's sick/on holiday - park where you like - park where you like anyway - she's got more than parking to worry about, in far worse places than Angmering.

However - in another 6000 years, the traffic orders will be changed AGAIN - to take responsibility away from the police and give it to local councils - who can employ ...... wardens - like they do in some towns already - and trust me, you don't park illegaly, or overstay your welcome in THOSE towns.

Guess who's got first dibs on the traffic warden post

[WelshFramer]

This problem has been going on for years, well, forever actually.

When we first moved in the main row of spaces (Google earth my postcode - BN164EA) was just a lay-by - no marked bays.

I can see at least six vacant spaces. Would be seven if it weren't for that idiot with the red car taking up two spaces.


Have you thought about hiring a traffic warden's uniform and issuing your own parking tickets?

[Roboframer]

The Google Earth photo was taken on a Sunday, I can see my car at home.

I have thought about the traffic warden thing, with tickets giving a promotional offer - pay £35 to/at the address below, or for one week only, make a donation of, £25 to a certain hospice and send proof of payment to the address below

[WelshFramer]

A small town near here introduced parking charges and used the money to employ a traffic warden. The net result was that the greengrocer and delicatessen closed within twelve months.

[kev@frames]

we have just heard that the local council is giving a day or two a month to completely free parking in the towns car parks (from the chamber of commerce pressure for "local shopping").
Considering that Penzance is supposed to be the second highest footfall of shoppers in Cornwall outside of Truro (the county town/city/capital) thats quite a nice gesture imho.
We are - fortunately- very well served with car parks here, although the charges are always moaned about.

The kick in the groin though: the District council is being abolished in a couple of months, replaced by a county-wide unitary authority
Nice while it lasted, though.

However, an example of what a little bit of organisation and comittment from your local chamber of commerce can sometimes achieve.

Whats the answer? a "shoppers" three hour car park free, and paid for out of increased business rates?

[Roboframer]

Our PCSO, after some emails, came down yesterday, specifically to enforce parking restrictions - she issued 3 fixed penalty notices - I laughed so much I got a stitch!

Could have been more but of course her very presence, well, being seen taking note of plates, made people dash out and shift their vehicles.

Proving that they could park wherever they did every day.