The Framers Forum

Had an artist in the other day, had a very high opinion of himself I must add, he had come around with a view to possibly displaying some of his work in the gallery.
Having had a cusory look around, he sniffily anounced that his work was too expensive for our gallery but asked if I had a Morso and would I offer a chop service.

Yes, I said, of course....... but our artist then added that he would supply the moulding, order it and have it delivered to our premises... how much would I charge??

Not being use to being put on the spot, I replied that it would be my hourly rate, the artist jumped at this having quickly rebuffed my offer to assemble his frames and then left the building.

Having mulled the situation over and still smarting from the derogatory attitude to the gallery, I emailed the chap and made clear that I would, in addition to the hourly rate be charging a figure to cover my overheads of £1.50 per foot levy on the job.

Needless to say, our artist has remained silent...

Just wondered how other members would charge for the above, on the basis that I am making nothing on the moulding, possible risk on the moulding being damaged ( though I would have required a disclaimer) and it is my facilities and equipment that is being used.

My feelings now are along the lines of, either I supply the mouldings for chop or tell the customer to go and get it done by the supplier!!

Cheers
Rob

Rob,
Perhaps you could ask this artist if he takes his own steak to the restaurant when he dines there. I don't think so!

I'm afraid my 'grumpy old man' status would have reared itself and I would have used that negative two letter word in the English language in response to his question........I'm sure you can guess what the word is.

Yes, Ormond, that just about confirms my thoughts on the matter and in future will be ready if this type of work appears.....
Cheers
Rob

Sounds like you are well rid of him!

My answer to that would be no, no and no.

Don't touch it! Tell him you do the whole job or not at all. He sounds like the sort who would ask Beethoven to shift a piano.

The next step will be him bringing the mangled moulding back complaining bitterly that it is faulty because he has no idea how to join it. Never work on stuff that the customer supplies. It will most likely be carp and it will be your fault whatever the frame turns out like.

Nigel Nobody wrote:I'm afraid my 'grumpy old man' status would have reared itself and I would have used that negative two letter word in the English language in response to his question........I'm sure you can guess what the word is.

My response probably would have had two more letters.

I would work out how much you would charge for those frames if you were doing everything, then take of the cost of the moulding at what you buy it in at (which may well be less than him), that way you are not losing out and he might get the message that you are a framer and not his handyman. I would also want 50% commission on the sale of his work . T

Don't think this clown will be back but thanks for the suggestions

The big question is was his work any good? I would love to know who he was so I can avoid him

i had one the other day asking if he could rent time on my cmc

wanted me to design the mounts, and bring his own board. then him rent the machine on a sunday and stand there cutting them

i suggested it wasnt the best idea. while being careful not to just say something un mentionable!!

I havbe a guy who does the design himself brings his own boards trimmed to size and I cut them for him at £5 each

Would not mind a few more like him.

I charge other framing freinds £5.00 for anything over half a sheet and £2.50 for anything under if they supply the board and have the design ready. I usually can invoice £40 -50 for half an hours work and the cost of a blade so not bade really, but I wouldn't want to rent my machine out to someone at all. If they want to do contract work then buy the machine rent premises, like I have had to do.

Jonny2morsos wrote:I havbe a guy who does the design himself brings his own boards trimmed to size and I cut them for him at £5 each

Would not mind a few more like him.

Really? I wouldn't do that for $500 each.
These miserable people want to take part of your income from you, by buying their own mats from your supplier and getting you to cut them. They are too mean to let you have just a reasonable amount of their income to pay you to supply what is normal in our industry, but they want to take part of your income just for their selfish benefit.

I won't do it because word would get around and every lousy artist and photographer (which would be 90% of them) in the area would buy their own mouldings, glass, matboards, foamboard, dee rings, tabs etc, from my suppliers and want me to work with them.

The trouble is that with various companies making cheap cheap mitre saws, underpinners etc it means there are many more framers therefore the skills are diluted. It makes it harder for the 'proper' framer to make a quid. ( am not saying I am a 'proper framer' but I am trying to do things right.)
25 years ago I doubt many non framers would have a go, where as now most diyers will.
As a photographer I have given up doing weddings as there is always 'Fred' down the village who has bought a digi lsr and will do a wedding dvd for £150 . I have seen the pictures, it shows
If you are a proper framer, charge proper money for work and try to keep the proper customers.
You have seen the frames and it shows.
So when the artist wants his stuff chopped, yes do it, but charge proper money for it.If they aren't prepared to pay that , stuff 'em!
Just my humble opinion.

This site has an important message about photographers:
http://youarenotaphotographer.com/

Just because they have taken a photography course of classes doesn't necessarily make them a photographer, either.

There is a similarity with framing. Just because someone buys a hammer and some nails, some wood and some glass doesn't make them a framer!

Ceebdub,
No, I'm not chopping their wood or cutting their sheets of mat! Not for any money. I've spent many years and tens of thousands of dollars obtaining the knowledge I have and I don't think it's appropriate for me to aid and abet someone to erode my income for a few lousy bucks.

Everyone can make their own decisions on that, but think about it seriously before you do!

@ Nigel , fair play.
I have thousands of pounds worth of equipment, years of experience and a degree (first class with honours), I agree don't sell yourself short.
But if you are sitting twiddling your thumbs , why not take a few bucks from the guy who wants a chop?
If you are at capacity then yes tell him to get stuffed.
As I said I have given up on the (what was) lucrative wedding game as there are so many 'pretenders' out there.

BTW I love the website you are not a photographer !

Thanks!
My website is ancient and in need of updating. I have been trying to get to that for many years. Don't know when or whether it will happen.

I have tens of thousands of dollars worth of equipment and 26 years of experience so I know where you're coming from.

There are many pretenders in both framing and photography.
No I'm not a photographer. I consider myself as a 'mug photographer' as I am own a DSLR and like to take photos of nature. I'm certainly not Ken Duncan or Peter Lik, but I have fun with it.
So you can see some of my 'mug photography' I will post a few in a new topic in 'After Hours'. Hopefully you might be able to offer some advice for improvement. I am always open to constructive criticism and ready to learn.

Thanks again!