The Framers Forum

I like really decent sized moulding samples. They look much better and help to convince the customers to spend more money to have something with a bit of quality to it. Unfortunately, some suppliers are somewhat inflexible on sample sizes and won't neccessarily compromise, even if you are willing to pay for your samples.

Lets be honest, life is just as hard for the suppliers, as the rest of us. So how many of us would be willing to pay a realistic price for better sized samples and help our suppliers by not expecting something for nothing in these difficult times.

The same is true of mountboard samples, bigger samples show the customer how much better things look with a decent sized mount and leads to better order values. Any comments!

How big are you talking? I just ordered a dozen 12" samples from Arqadia and the rep termed those as medium.

I wouldn't pay for any samples. If a company wants me to sell there product then pos should be free. As a commercial framer I don't have samples as such I order them as required and leave them with the client so they have their own selection to choose from.

I understand that free samples is open to abuse but I don't take anything I don't want or think might be of interest to my clients.

Hi Allistair,

I'm talking about companies who will supply a 12" length to make a sample, even when it's a larger profile moulding. Fair do's, free samples must cost our suppliers an absolute fortune and I'm not picking out any particular supplier.

To be honest, I get fed up with tiny little samples which don't look as good as they should and make it harder to sell those particular mouldings, even when I know that they would look stunning with the particular customers artwork.

I am strongly in favour of large samples. A 2" or 3" wide moulding just looks silly with a 6" chevron. (My theory why some framers never sell expensive mouldings - if you have 6" chevrons, only the skinny mouldings look right).

Chevrons should all be the same length so they look good on the wall, and should all be mitred or reverse mitred to match. My choice would be 12" or 30cm.

I have some sympathy with Alistair's point that POS material should be free, but I also have sympathy with the moulding suppliers who give away the smallest possible sample, because many framers never bother to display the samples they have asked for.

The solution - the framer pays a nominal fee for a generous size of sample.

This would not prevent suppliers from supplying new businesses, or those not willing to pay for samples, with shorter FOC samples.

Perhaps some of us would be willing to put our money, where our mouths are, and see what the suppliers think about the idea. I expect that any suppliers thinking of making changes in their policy will be looking to see what kind of response there will be to this idea.

Maybe some suppliers may have comments to make as well.

I show Nielsen artcare mount samples and some Arqadia, they're both (about) 11x11x4" wide - both provide them free (plus a caddy and a colour selector chart) and the size is just fine; when some get minging I have that size/shape saved and cut new ones from offcuts, when too many get minging/dog-eared I pick up the phone and order a complete new set. I have longer/wider samples to show washlines and other stuff.

Most of my moulding samples are 19cm - but I mean corner samples, if I ask for a sample of a moulding I get a 'reference cut' which can vary from 4-12" depending on the supplier. One supplier will send me two 12" reference cuts to make my own sample, but I'll still make it a 19cm sample unless it's a bit of a monster.

Another suppiler will charge me for a 19cm (or so) corner sample but will send me a half metre length to make my own for free.

Another does not like to give OR sell samples, but will discount a first time order on a new moulding by 20% to account for the corner sample I have to take out of it.

Suppliers aren't daft, they know you have to show it to sell it and they are prepared to speculate to accumulate, but by just how much will or may depend on how much business you put their way or how much potential business they think you could. If those boxes can't be ticked then it's probably a case of them letting you doing the speculating and making your samples from full lengths and/or sheets of mount board, and I don't see anything wrong with that.

Roboframer wrote:making your samples from full lengths and/or sheets of mount board

On mouldings which I have chosen to be a new stock item, I just order a couple of lengths, make a sample and wait for a customer who needs a rush job. Then I use the magic words, "I have this one in stock and can do it while you wait" - SOLD!

I've started doing this with some useful Polcore and Emafil mouldings for my new commercial customers. I not only supply them and myself with samples, but I tell them that they are all in stock for a quick turn around service.

I haven't been doing the commercial thing for long at all, but the cost of keeping a small stock of budget priced polymer mouldings is minimal and my customers like the fast service for made to measure RMF's and mounts, sometimes even while they wait!

I think Robo hit the nail on the head

Roboframer wrote:Suppliers aren't daft, they know you have to show it to sell it and they are prepared to speculate to accumulate, but by just how much will or may depend on how much business you put their way or how much potential business they think you could.

I am in the fortunate position of being in business for a number of years and I have a relatively high turnover with suppliers. As I have said I have never abused the system only ordering what I want.

I must say when you have a large moulding 4" wide a 12" sample is no use to man na beast even 24" is pushing it, and if you don't have a sufficient moulding then your not going to sell it.

We could of course all use some nice visualization software

Most of my samples are 400mm on a side and none are available from any suppliers.

I have two of these to display my moulding chevrons on: Chevrons cut with a 190mm long side fit just nicely so a 15" sample suits us best but for some reason despite requests I always seem to get 12" sections.

With larger mouldings where I have been sent a 12" piece I am now screwing a D Ring on one end and hanging them on the wall.

As regards paying for samples, Arqadia and Simons send 12" pieces FOC but I would happily pay for a second on larger profiles if they asked. Tawnycraft give me samples ready made into chevrons complete with ref. numbers and velcro and I can request extras for my trade customers again free. I am happy with the Lion system of paying a nominal amount for made up chevrons with credit against future orders.

Sending samples made up into chevrons does mean they go straight on display rather than waiting until I get a bit of spare time to make them up myself.

Daler mountboard chevrons come 4" but Arqadia 3" which is about the minimum I feel. I hate the Colourmount samples that are stamped out and have no bevelled edge. Spoken to them about this but they seem insistant on doing it this way and like to print the information on the back (which is on colour chart).

My supplier recently sent me a load of new samples FOC and sent 15" samples, and this had made a difference to the mouldings I am selling to my customers (as was mentioned would happen in an above post). With the set up of our shop, we have 2 different boards, so I put the wider mouldings on the different board thus being able use different sized chevrons

FF

The last two lots of moulding samples I got from Simons were 12" long, BUT and it's a Big But, there were TWO of each sample, and that's for thin and wider moulding, I could make some decent samples up
Great service.

Steve

I got that as well. It means I can give them to a good client as well.

Speak to your local Simons rep and ask for chevron size samples, these are also FOC