The Framers Forum

jeez pete

first you dismiss the experts in the field because they sell the posters too

and you say outright that my information was wrong. and cant back it up

and then say well there is not proven research, well if there is no research how can you say either of us is right or wrong

You do come over as a little defensive Old Master. But you have livened the forum up a bit and I always enjoy that. So apologies if you felt my posting offended.

from a small amount of research

http://www.cinemasterpieces.com/cinedef ... %20backing

LINEN BACKING

Linen backing can dramatically improve the overall appearance of a poster and it can substantially increase its value. It is an archival poster conservation method where the poster is de-acidified and mounted with wheat paste onto acid free paper and adhered to canvas. This process provides stability to the piece and prevents possible deterioration. It smoothes and flattens out waves and wrinkles and makes creases and folds much less noticeable (sometimes invisible). If needed, restoration can then be done. Once linen backed, a poster is easier to handle, is ready for framing, or it may be rolled for shipping. If not framing a linen backed poster, we recommend storing it flat and not rolled. Should a linen backed poster sustain physical damage in the future, poster removal is possible. This cannot be said for most other mounting methods. Linen backing is not absolutely necessary for most posters, but for a valuable one it is a good idea because it helps to preserve it. We have our posters linen backed by world renowned paper conservation professionals. They do work for all the major movie studios and museums.

Be nice if they left a few little tabs on the linen around the sides - framers for the use of.

I would not say that the use of linen backing, or the lack of linen backing should be treated as a determining factor in the actual value of the poster. Neither does rarity neccessarily imply value. The value depends upon the actual item, it's condition, authenticy and it's provable market value.

For me the important issues when framing this are: preservation, complete reversibility and adherence to best practice. I would recommend cotton museum mountboard to the customer and I would have a careful and detailed conversation with them about UV protective glazing options.

Wheat starch paste and Japanese tissue hinges would be my first thoughts when mounting this. There may be other ways of mounting this, but long term protection, complete reversiblity and adherance to best practice would be my priority.

So, Adam, you've had three suggestions ..

Hinge - as you would if it were on paper - method that is but maybe not the same materials - the poster is probably bonded to the linen with starch paste so maybe that would be a good choice for hinges? Starch paste is the cheapest adhesive I use - happens to be also the most easily-reversible - win-win?

Platform Mount

Mounting strips.

Sticking down has been mentioned but not actually suggested for this

An Old Master wrote:straightforward sticking down is far simpler and just as effective.

(As a platform mount)

It's not simpler, you have to know what you're doing applying wet adhesive to artwork (or to a board that artwork will be placed on) and anyone can bond two bits of mount board together - I know this because I can do it! You also have to position the artwork - or maybe stick it on to a board larger than required and trim excess off around the window mount.

Don't have to do either with the platform mount - it positions the artwork for you, it just drops in.

Doesn't matter if you cock it up (the wet bonding bit), it's just mount board.

Less area to bond (in this case) so actually cheaper and quicker than wet mounting the artwork. I'm not talking conservation, I'm talking drop dead simple. Leaving the artwork in exactly the same condition as it was given to you is a nice bonus, I think.

Then there's the edge-mounting strips, even simpler, even quicker, even cheaper .... with the same added bonus.

A question (to anyone and everyone) If you have a few options at your disposal - for whatever - not just this, and, for argument's sake, they're all just as effective as each other, all take the same amount of time, all cost the same, to both yourself and the customer, but one of them totally alters the original state of the artwork (as presented to you) - are you going to choose that option?

.

stcstc wrote:jeez pete

first you dismiss the experts in the field because they sell the posters too

and you say outright that my information was wrong. and cant back it up

and then say well there is not proven research, well if there is no research how can you say either of us is right or wrong

Vested interests.
You are wrong, but I cant't be bothered to labour the point even more.
There is very little, if any, proven research on the efficacy of linen lining of 1940s posters.
Please consider yourself right if that's what you want.
The End.

An Old Master wrote:A 1940s piece of toilet paper would be 'rare' too.

Great, I wouldn't stick that down either, and definitely would not stick down the ...

An Old Master wrote:extremely delicate letter hand written by a famous statesman

.... to anything or with anything. I could give at least three simple and stress-free methods, depending, that could be undone by a trained chimp, or at a push, me!

If for any reason the customer insisted that I stuck it down I'd refer him/her to you/someone else - I just wouldn't do it. I might suggest a scan and print that I could embalm and when it fades, just reprint and re-embalm while the original stays safe(r) somewhere.

I use platform mounts on a regular basis these days ( curtsy of roboframer ), I find them quick easy to do and very effective, I would consider this option. I would also consider float mounting using pass through hinges ( lots of them ) then a mount around that leaving a small gap between the poster and mount (so long as there is not extra linen around it), this would promote a even colour fade.
I have had a few with extra linen around and have used fabric hinges stitched to the extra fabric which worked very well, these were very large and quite heavy film posters though, I originally did this because paper hinges failed twice.

I am not a FATG member though, these are just the options I would consider.

Ought to have asked if there is any spare linen around the edge. I'm thinking probably not.

How about using a similar fabric to the backing for hinges and fixing a few around the edges which could be folded around a board. Rather like floating a big watercolour. Tight at the top and a bit of wiggle room on the others. Gluing them on might be tricky. I think I would start with starch paste and see how it holds. Teasing out the fibres in the tabs would spread the load and hopefully prevent a hard line appearing at the front.

Only problem I can see with platform mounting is that it's not a stiff as say, a big sheet of heavy wc paper and is likely to sag and drop down in the frame.

Well I've done it on large posters that are not stuck to linen and therefore lighter/floppier, plus smaller things that are extremely light - wouldn't be any good if it was just fabric - and it's possibly not suitable for this - again, I did say 'maybe' to start with.

Just in case anyone missed the link within one of my links above ..... Post No 9 here http://www.thegrumble.com/showthread.ph ... rix-poster.

WOW ! What a response this thread got, I have only just logged in again, over 50 posts ???
love the suggestions and it got a bit heated as well, I think Old Master had his tongue firmly in his cheek with some of his comments, he certainly got a response

When I have framed it I will post a photo and a run down on how I framed it.

Thanks everyone
Adam/Bagpuss

Very shrewd Bagpuss - I like your style.